Tuesday Reads: We’re Approaching a Constitutional Crisis


Good Morning!!

It’s been two weeks since the election, and I think we’re already very close to a constitutional crisis. Each day we wake up to new insanity from the “president elect.” And yes, I do believe that he is insane. Something needs to be done very quickly and I’m not sure anyone in authority is going to act. As Matthew Yglesias wrote recently, we only have until noon on January 20, 2017 to stop Donald Trump from systemically corrupting our institutions. We’ve posted this article before, but everyone should save it and refer to it often.

The legal responsibilities of what is a body corporate do not change with the appointment of a manager. The corporation must still have a Presiding Officer, a Secretary and a Treasurer, who must all be members of the corporation, and it is still legally liable for decisions made on its behalf.


The country has entered a dangerous period. The president-elect is the least qualified man to ever hold high office. He also operated the least transparent campaign of the modern era. He gave succor and voice to bigoted elements on a scale not seen in two generations. He openly praised dictators — not as allies but as dictators — and threatened to use the powers of his office to discipline the media.

He also has a long history of corrupt behavior, and his business holdings pose staggering conflicts of interest that are exacerbated by his lack of financial disclosure. But while most journalists and members of the opposition party think they understand the threat of Trump-era corruption, they are in fact drastically underestimating it. When we talk about corruption in the modern United States, we have in mind what Andrei Shleifer and Robert Vishnydefine as “the sale by government officials of government property for personal gain.”

This is the classic worry about campaign contributions or revolving doors — the fear that wealthy interests can give money to public officials and in exchange receive favorable treatment from the political system. But in a classic essay on “The Concept of Systemic Corruption in American History,” the economist John Joseph Wallis repminds us that in the Revolutionary Era and during the founding of the republic, Americans worried about something different. Not the venal corruption we are accustomed to thinking about, but what he calls systemic corruption. He writes that 18th-century thinkers “worried much more that the king and his ministers were manipulating grants of economic privileges to secure political support for a corrupt and unconstitutional usurpation of government powers.”

We are used to corruption in which the rich buy political favor. What we need to learn to fear is corruption in which political favor becomes the primary driver of economic success.


Donald Trump is more dangerous than any potential president in history, because he is a sociopath with zero empathy for anyone but himself and he seems to be incapable of feeling shame.

Past presidents have been restrained from behaving in such a manner by institutional checks and balances that are eroding under the pressure of rising partisan polarization.

But most of all, past presidents have simply been restrained by restraint. By a belief that there are certain things one simply cannot try or do. Yet Trump has repeatedly triumphed in circumstances that most predicted were impossible. As Ezra Klein has written, he operates entirely without shame:

It’s easy to underestimate how important shame is in American politics. But shame is our most powerful restraint on politicians who would find success through demagoguery. Most people feel shame when they’re exposed as liars, when they’re seen as uninformed, when their behavior is thought cruel, when respected figures in their party condemn their actions, when experts dismiss their proposals, when they are mocked and booed and protested.

Trump doesn’t. He has the reality television star’s ability to operate entirely without shame, and that permits him to operate entirely without restraint. It is the single scariest facet of his personality. It is the one that allows him to go where others won’t, to say what others can’t, to do what others wouldn’t.

Trump lives by the reality television trope that he’s not here to make friends. But the reason reality television villains always say they’re not there to make friends is because it sets them apart, makes them unpredictable and fun to watch. “I’m not here to make friends” is another way of saying, “I’m not bound by the social conventions of normal people.” The rest of us are here to make friends, and it makes us boring, gentle, kind.

Trump does not care if normally conservative newspapers’ editorial pages denounce him, if media fact-checkers slam him, if GOP operatives furiously tweet against him, or anything else.

TV journalists and execs at Trump Tower yesterday

TV journalists and execs at Trump Tower yesterday

Since the publication of that piece on November 17, the situation has gotten more and more grave. It seems Trump does care what newspapers and TV networks say about him, but his response will be to try to control what they write and broadcast, not reverse his own corrupt behavior. As we all know, Trump called some broadcast media representatives into an off-the-record meeting yesterday. These craven executives and reporters attended the meeting and were treated to a “dressing down” by a screaming Trump. The story first leaked out to the right-wing, Trump-favoring New York Post.

“It was like a f−−−ing firing squad,” one source said of the encounter.

“Trump started with [CNN chief] Jeff Zucker and said, ‘I hate your network, everyone at CNN is a liar and you should be ashamed,’ ” the source said.

“The meeting was a total disaster. The TV execs and anchors went in there thinking they would be discussing the access they would get to the Trump administration, but instead they got a Trump-style dressing-down,” the source added.

A second source confirmed the fireworks.

“The meeting took place in a big boardroom and there were about 30 or 40 people, including the big news anchors from all the networks,” the other source said.

“Trump kept saying, ‘We’re in a room of liars, the deceitful, dishonest media who got it all wrong.’ He addressed everyone in the room, calling the media dishonest, deceitful liars. He called out Jeff Zucker by name and said everyone at CNN was a liar, and CNN was [a] network of liars,” the source said.

“Trump didn’t say [NBC reporter] Katy Tur by name, but talked about an NBC female correspondent who got it wrong, then he referred to a horrible network correspondent who cried when Hillary lost who hosted a debate — which was Martha Raddatz, who was also in the room.”

More TV bigshots summoned by Trump yesterday

More TV bigshots summoned by Trump yesterday

I guess it wasn’t enough that CNN paid multiple Trump supporters to defend him against any criticism. Here’s a more staid version of the story from The New York Times. And there’s this one from David Remnick at The New Yorker: Donald Trump Personally Blasts the Press.

First came the obsessive Twitter rants directed at “Hamilton” and “Saturday Night Live.” Then came Monday’s astonishing aria of invective and resentment aimed at the media, delivered in a conference room on the twenty-fifth floor of Trump Tower. In the presence of television executives and anchors, Trump whined about everything from NBC News reporter Katy Tur’s coverage of him to a photograph the news network has used that shows him with a double chin. Why didn’t they use “nicer” pictures?

For more than twenty minutes, Trump railed about “outrageous” and “dishonest” coverage. When he was asked about the sort of “fake news” that now clogs social media, Trump replied that it was the networks that were guilty of spreading fake news. The “worst,” he said, were CNN (“liars!”) and NBC.

This is where we are. The President-elect does not care who knows how unforgiving or vain or distracted he is. This is who he is, and this is who will be running the executive branch of the United States government for four years.

The overall impression of the meeting from the attendees I spoke with was that Trump showed no signs of having been sobered or changed by his elevation to the country’s highest office. Rather, said one, “He is the same kind of blustering, bluffing, blowhard as he was during the campaign.”

Another participant at the meeting said that Trump’s behavior was “totally inappropriate” and “fucking outrageous.” The television people thought that they were being summoned to ask questions; Trump has not held a press conference since late July. Instead, they were subjected to a stream of insults and complaints—and not everyone absorbed it with pleasure.

“I have to tell you, I am emotionally fucking pissed,” another participant said. “How can this not influence coverage? I am being totally honest with you. Toward the end of the campaign, it got to a point where I thought that the coverage was all about [Trump’s] flaws and problems. And that’s legit. But, I thought, O.K., let’s give them the benefit of the doubt. After the meeting today, though—and I am being human with you here—I think, Fuck him! I know I am being emotional about it. And I know I will get over it in a couple of days after Thanksgiving. But I really am offended. This was unprecedented. Outrageous!”

Let’s hope none of them “get over it.”

This morning Trump cancelled a scheduled meeting with The New York Times, claiming the newspaper tried to “change the ground rules.” The New York Times responded that that did not happen.

Supposedly the meet has been rescheduled now.

This is all so unbelievable, but it’s only the tip of the iceberg of Trump insanity this country is going to be dealing with. In just a few days we’ve seen that the level of storage facilities westminster co is comparable to what has happened in the worst dictatorships around the globe. Dakinikat wrote about this yesterday, and there’s already more corruption in the news today.

The New York Times: With a Meeting, Trump Renewed a British Wind Farm Fight.

When President-elect Donald J. Trumpmet with the British politician Nigel Farage in recent days, he encouraged Mr. Farage and his entourage to oppose the kind of offshore wind farms that Mr. Trump believes will mar the pristine view from one of his two Scottish golf courses, according to one person present.

The meeting, held shortly after the presidential election, raises new questions about Mr. Trump’s willingness to use the power of the presidency to advance his business interests. Mr. Trump has long opposed a wind farm planned near his course in Aberdeenshire, and he previously fought unsuccessfully all the way to Britain’s highest court to block it.

The group that met with Mr. Trump in New York was led by Mr. Farage, the head of the U.K. Independence Party and a member of the European Parliament. Mr. Farage, who was a leading voice advocating Britain’s exit from the European Union, or Brexit, campaigned with Mr. Trump during the election. Arron Banks, an insurance executive who was a major financier of the Brexit campaign, was also in attendance.

“He did not say he hated wind farms as a concept; he just did not like them spoiling the views,” said Andy Wigmore, the media consultant who was present at the meeting and was photographed with Mr. Trump.

Mr. Wigmore headed communications for Leave.EU, one of the two groups that led the Brexit effort. He said in an email that he and Mr. Banks would be “campaigning against wind farms in England, Scotland and Wales.”

This morning Trump tweeted that he wants Great Britain to appoint Nigel Farage as ambassador to the U.S.!

British Prime Minister Teresa May told CNN that’s not going to happen. But this is just one more breach of protocol by the out-of-control “president elect.”

I haven’t even scratched the surface of this morning’s shocking news. I have an important appointment this afternoon, but I’ll post more links when I can. 

Now it’s your turn. Have at it.

87 Comments on “Tuesday Reads: We’re Approaching a Constitutional Crisis”

  1. bostonboomer says:

    It’s really looking more and more like the election was hacked. It may be time to demand recounts in swing states. Hillary is going to win the popular vote by at least 2.5 million votes and maybe more.

    From statistics genius Bill James: Fixing a Presidential Election.

    It’s long and I haven’t read all of it yet.

    • NW Luna says:

      I feel more heartsick than ever. I finished reading the whole article. Pennsylvania and Florida are the most likely states and the easiest to hack. That’s not the whole gist of the article, but that really hit at me, especially with the odd change in FL voting from early voting to later, and the weirdness of the Pennsylvania result.

    • gregoryp says:

      How do you do recounts in these states with electronic voting machines that have no paper trail? Our constitution has no mechanisms built in that we can re-vote or prevent election fraud of this kind. I guess they believed strongly that the Electoral College would be infallible but it over represents the states that are sparsely populated.

    • janicen says:

      It’s really good. I believe that the election was stolen. Hillary won, her message was strong and she reached the voters she needed to reach but criminals stole the election. There’s nothing we can do about it, but at least we can say that all of the experts who are telling us about all of the things that HRC did wrong, are full of shit. Yippee.

  2. bostonboomer says:

    Mother Jones: White Nationalists See Trump as their Troll in Chief. Is He With Them?
    by Josh Harkinson


  3. bostonboomer says:

    This morning Trump announced that he won’t seek to prosecute Hillary Clinton. That is another breach of ethics. The president is not supposed to make decisions on whom the DOJ prosecutes.


  4. bostonboomer says:

    The Guardian:

    Trump v the media: did his tactics mortally wound the fourth estate?
    by Ed Pilkington


  5. Pat Johnson says:

    It keeps getting worse by the day. We have a madman in the White House. I shudder to think what will happen to us since we cannot trust anybody or anything.

    Our prized institutions have been corrupted. The media has let us down. Our elected officials are about to gut our laws. I have zero faith in the Democrats to protect us from harm.

    This man is crazy and the people surrounding him are just as bad. I am coming to the conclusion that the election was “stolen” in ways we have yet to discover. How can someone with 2 million more popular votes lose? It makes no sense unless there was “tampering” in those states he “won”.

    The FBI was in collusion with this candidate. The Russian government assisted. The corporate press paved his way. None of this can be denied.

    He got away without revealing his tax forms. Most of us agree he is unfit. This did not happen in a vacuum.

    We are facing the abyss. This man is a lying crook as well as showing there are serious issues regarding his mental health.

    What actually is going on?

    • bostonboomer says:

      Trump appears to be trying to become a dictator.

      • Pilgrim says:

        Masha Gessen (writer of “The Man without a Face,” on Putin) says that Trump is “the first person to run as an autocrat, and win”.

        • Joanelle says:

          “The meeting, held shortly after the presidential election, raises new questions about Mr. Trump’s willingness to use the power of the presidency to advance his business interests.”
          The man is sick – we have a lunatic at the helm, we have crashed and next we will burn unless the Electoral College et. al. takes a stand
          The boyz in Washington have to step up instead of the typical cowardly backing up that is typical of them.

  6. bostonboomer says:

    Read this timeline for much more information on Trump’s deal with Macri in Argentina. Following their phone call, the tower project is moving ahead.


  7. bostonboomer says:


    • Pat Johnson says:

      Not surprising since he allowed Howard Stern’s remark that Ivanka “was a piece of ass” to go unchallenged on a radio broadcast.

      Most “normal” fathers would never allow that remark to go unnoticed but Trump’s response was “yeah”. Sick, sick, sick.

      There is something very wrong with him and I think as time goes on we will discover his marriage to Melania is one big scam. She appears “devoted” to their child but I bet it is a handy excuse to keep her distance from this pig elect.

      However, that being said maybe more scrutiny should be give Ivanka’s role in all of this. She seems more than willing to overlook his behavior while attaching herself very strongly to him.

      This is beginning to look like one sick family.

    • dakinikat says:

      more appropriate picture on this one

  8. William says:

    I fully appreciate the horror of all of this. But I must say that I take some pleasure in the media’s outrage because the person they allowed to win the presidency, instead of being so pleased with them, and giving them all sorts of access, screamed at them. They all deserve being screamed at, and worse, but by our side. They did everything possible to get Trump to win; from ceaselessly criticizing Hillary for every made up thing, to obscuring Trump’s conflicts of interest, and trying to normalize him. I don’t know why they did this; it is either because they or their corporate bosses desperately wanted Trump to win; or that they are just abysmally stupid and incompetent. And that they just had a visceral dislike of Hillary, born of jealousy and their own pretentiousness. Whatever it was, it got Trump elected, as surely as I am typing this.

    As to the rest of it, I would urge everyone to call the DOJ to request an audit of the vote. It probably will do no good, because President Obama does not seem to want to do anything to rock the boat before it likely sinks; but it is worth a try. The number I was given to at least leave a message, was 202-514-0469, I left one this morning .I think the direct number to talk to someone is 202-353-1555, but that rings busy. At least we can try. I agree with BB that the election was probably literally stolen, that more people actually voted for Hillary in those swing states than for Trump, but that their votes are either not being counted (illegally struck from the voting rolls by “Operation Crosscheck,” and their provisional ballots are not being added in), or the Russians did indeed hack the voting machines. I read that in Wisconsin, in districts where they used paper ballots, Hillary won, while in areas with machine counting, Trump won. In addition to all the other horrible corrupt entities which influenced the election, this is probably the most awful, the very real possibility that the votes were stolen. The last possibility is for the DOJ to do an audit, or for someone to immediately call for a recount in key states. Otherwise, it will be too late. I do not understand why Obama, and even Hillary, do not risk the inevitable media censure, b calling fot this. The media is worthless, anyway; all their complaining about Trump after the fact is not going to do much good. So make the last gallant bid to save the democracy now.

  9. NW Luna says:

    BB, really good post. I don’t say that often enough. You and dak and JJ have my admiration and thankfulness that you are posting!

  10. dakinikat says:

    We are so fucked …

  11. contrask says:

    I’ve done everything I could, called the DOJ, signed all the petitions and started connecting to local people to become an activist. Who cares about our democracy? Why is there such silence from anyone in authority? Trump has essentially essentially installed his own state media already. This is surreal. It will only get worse.

  12. dakinikat says:

    Donald Trump meets with creationist Jerry Falwell Jr about possibly becoming next Secretary of Education
    Jerry Falwell has been one of Mr Trump’s strongest supporters


    Separation of church and state any one? Can he say radical christianists?

    • contrask says:

      I absolutely posted a few days ago that I thought radicalized Christians were more of a concern for our nation than radicalized Muslims.

    • Pat Johnson says:

      I have been screaming about that for years. The biggest problem we were facing was the blurred lines that were becoming evident between church and state.

      Our major problems lie from within. Fundamentalists intent on forcing their superstitions into the public square.

      Here it comes all tied up in a neat little bow and heaven help those of us who choose otherwise.

      One Christian nation under god. It’s what these crackpots have been longing for for years.

  13. dakinikat says:

    Well. I guess the ice floes aren’t good enough for me … I’m going to get a space in a gulag

    New website seeks to register professors accused of liberal bias and “anti-American values.”


    • contrask says:

      OMG – this is beyond the pale. There it is, an agenda straight from those radicalized Christians who are so afraid of their kids hearing an opinion different from their own. Some of you guys think different than me – wahwahwah.

    • Minkoff Minx says:

      My god. What the fuck is going to happen this time next year? It has only been a few weeks.

    • NW Luna says:

      Ah, from a group that values “limited” government. Limited enough to get in your classroom, your bedroom, your clinic room….

  14. dakinikat says:

  15. dakinikat says:

     Struggling White Voters Who Helped Elect Trump Are Headed for Some Serious Pain
    A lot of low-income voters believed Trump when he promised to make America great. They’re in for a rude awakening.
    By Joshua HollandTwitter


     It is these very voters—less educated, struggling to get by on low incomes—who will bear the brunt of unified Republican government under Trump. The GOP Congress may give Trump his “infrastructure plan,” but that looks like it will consist of a bunch of tax cuts for investors to sink into toll bridges and toll roads. It will definitely give him the rest of his huge tax cuts, but those are skewed toward those at the top and won’t bring much relief to the “forgotten men and women of this country,” as he promised when campaigning. If the GOP repeals the Affordable Care Act, as it’s vowed to do since it was enacted, many of these voters will lose their subsidized health insurance. Block-granting Medicaid and privatizing Medicare will dramatically increase these their economic insecurity. They’ll lose food stamps and Head Start slots. They’ll lose access to reproductive health care. They can forget about a hike in the federal minimum wage. According to one estimate, 20 million Trump voters will lose out on a big raise when Republicans kill Obama’s overtime rule. And if the GOP doesn’t get rid of it entirely, they’ll at least hobble the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, which reined in the kind of predatory lending schemes that often indenture the working poor. It’ll be death by a thousand cuts.

    • Pat Johnson says:

      He was never going to give up his business interests. He did not expect to win but his intent all along was to maintain control of the brand.

      It is up to congress to rein him in. And I doubt that will happen since it is a GOP majority.

      He may even get some lawyers to write the law his favor just as Bush did with the Iraqi invasion and torture.

      It gets worse by the day,

  16. Riverbird says:

    Two weeks after the election, and I still wake up every morning in disbelief. I don’t know how I’ll get through the next four years.

  17. William says:

    We are the majority, but our system has failed us. I read that Hillary won 400 or so national counties out of about 3000, but the key is that those counties she won are about two-thirds of the national economy! All the big cities went to her. Republicans have found a way to turn a popular vote and economically producing minority into a governing majority The system orgiinally set up by the Founders contained a serious flaw which they did not foresee at the time. First, the fact that each state has two senators, so that CA’s and NY’s 40 million or so votes for four senators is canceled out by Wyoming’s and Idaho’s 800,000 or so total votes for senators. That leads to the electoral college system wherein a bunch of small states have the power to overccome the popular will. Everyone is supposed to be equal here. But people in CA have much less of a vote than those in the small states. Do we have to have half of this state move to other states to try to win more electoral votes in those? What kind of s stupid system is this? CA is the sixth largest economy in the world, if we were a country, and we are paying taxes to keep the redneck states afloat. Not that there aren’t good people in every state, but there are not enough of them in these right-wing states which now have the power to get a creationist appointed as Education Secretary, a climate denier as head of EPA, the architect of the evil and illegal Operation Crosscheck as head of HHS. This is not only not morally right, it is not democratic. The majority of people did not vote to have their Social Security and Medicare taken away.

    So what is to do? This is war, though of course we do not propose to take up rifles and start shooting. But we have to somehow find a way to turn the system in our favor, even if it means destroying the economies of the Red states. Unfortunately, Democrats are far too busy being nice, to have any ruthless political planners like the Republicans have. We need some, and fast. And if it takes something like a million Californians not paying their taxes for a year, maybe that is the kind of financial or legal sacrifice we have to make. We can’t just let this go on, because it is not going away of its own accord, it is inherent in our electoral system Our hope was that Hillary could win, get the Supreme Court we wanted, and then strengthen the VRA and stop the calculated suppression of voters. But the suppressors cheated their way out of that. So now we have to somehow assert the popular power we have. Waiting for the poendulum to swing back may well be the wrong course in these dire straits. I mentioned the other day such thoughts as no one traveling for pleasure to Red states; people trying to avoid buying any product from a company based in a Red state. Maybe pulling all of our money out of the stock market. Somehow our popular and economic power has to be wielded, because our country’s archaic electoral system has failed us. Any other thoughts along this line would be very welcome, because “fighting” has to be done with a plan in mind.

    • Beata says:

      “But we have to somehow find a way to turn the system in our favor, even if it means destroying the economies of the Red states.”

      And destroying the people of “the Red states” along with their economies? Are you comfortable with that, William? I know you have been to only one state outside your native California in your life but are those people just “dots” to you? They seem to be.

      • William says:

        I know the line, I read the book. Do not worry, the Blue states are not going to wreck the economy of Red states. The people from Red states are going to wreck the quality of life of everyone. They voted for what may be the end of Social Security and Medicare. They voted for global warming unchecked. They voted for cuts in overtime pay. They voted for the ultimate destruction of the American dollar, through a combination of massive tax cuts for the very wealthy, and an infrastucture program which will cost trillions and will further benefit the rich. And they voted for attacks of Jewish people, Blacks, Latinos, Muslims, and just about every minority. They might not be smart enough to realize what they did, but they may be at that. And they’re not all like that there, but enough of them are. “Lock Her Up!” “Trump That Bitch!” I really have no sympathy for any of them, it is just a tragedy that they will drag everyone else into their morass.

        • Beata says:

          Don’t forget that they also voted for attacks on the disabled. I know how deeply that pains you, William, after all the volunteer work you have done over the years for the most vulnerable among us.

          • joanelle says:

            Go to the DOJ, I went yesterday and couldn’t get through because the line was continually busy, so I clicked on CONTACT and wrote my rational for believing that there may have been some hacking, similar to what William said above and submitted it. Today I plan to urge Hillary’s campaign to challenge the outcome and ask for an audit and a recount. We owe action to 240 years of Demcracy and the citizens of our country all of them, even those who just don’t know any better, or don’t know what to do. Spread the word get everyone who is sitting there wringing thier hand to get off thier duffs and do it!!!

          • Beata says:

            Thank you, Joanelle. I haven’t been able to get through to the DOJ but I will find a way to do it today.

            I believe some members of Hillary’s staff have been calling for an audit and recount on Twitter? I’m not on any social media sites so I can’t communicate there.

        • ANonOMouse says:

          “The people from Red states are going to wreck the quality of life of everyone”

          And actually, it is the Red States that have wrecked the economies of the Blue States with their “right to work” laws that basically neuter unions. That combined with lower wages, lower cost of utilities and forebearance of property tax obligation has moved industry out of the Blue States and transferred it to the Red States.

          I’ve spent a lifetime in a Red State and I’m not too damned worried about how the Red States fare. They’ve supported every vile GOP Presidential Candidate to come along for decades. They’ve passed gross, despicable anti-choice laws that have run almost every abortion providers in the South out of business. And they’ve supported every disgraceful anti-LGBT law that any Xtian nut case has suggested. They are terrified of people of color and see immigrants as the enemy. In my state of residence they passed a law in the State Legislature to stop cities and city councils from passing protections to the LGBT community, even after the largest city in the State had passed LGBT protections for City and County employees overwhelming. They basically overturned the will of the community via the State Legislature.

          I’m in my 70’s and my wife and I are thinking about joining my oldest daughter on the left coast. At least there our marriage will be recognized when Trump SCOTUS judges overturn Marriage Equality. If the people in the Red States want to create laws that limit women’s authority over their own bodies and try to pass laws to put LGBT people back in the closet. And create hostile and difficult living environments for people of color, I HOPE THEY ALL FALL FLAT ON THEIR ASSES.

      • Sweet Sue says:

        Why do you take every opportunity to pick on William (yes, I know he can stand up for himself and more eloquently than I could) and ascribe all kinds of nefarious motives to him?
        I’ve held my tongue for so goddamn long.

        • Beata says:

          I have known William for many years and we happen to disagree on some issues. I see no reason to hold my tongue about them. Why is that a problem for you, Sue? William enjoys a good argument and can indeed stand up for himself.

        • Beata says:

          BTW, Sue, you can go back to the early days after Hillary’s loss when William was feeling very down and I expressed my friendship for him in a long comment. In fact, it is because of me that William found Sky Dancing. I told him about it.

          • bostonboomer says:

            We all have disagreements from time to time. I said I agreed with William, but I certainly don’t want innocent people in red states to suffer. I missed that. And yes, Beata is the one who introduced William to Sky Dancing.

            This is what happens with authoritarian leaders. People turn on each other–as some in the Democratic Party are doing now.

            I just want to say that I love every one of you no matter what our disagreements. We are all in this together and have been for a very long time.

          • Sweet Sue says:

            Beata, comparing an erudite, thoughtful gentleman like William to Harry Lime, one of the most despicable villains in movies just raised my very Irish hackles.
            As I recall, Harry sold tainted vaccine sera to hospitals caring for refugee children.
            What I wrote was pretty aggressive and I do apologize for that.
            I guess we’re all a little on edge.

          • Beata says:

            Sue, I echo what BB said about us all being in this together. It is a very difficult time but we will get through it somehow.

            I hope you have a good Thanksgiving, even if it seems there is little for which to be thankful.

        • William says:

          Thank you, Sue, and yes, I appreciate it.

  18. MsMass says:

    I don’t know if this will do any good but I sent my rant to Elizabeth Warren:

    Join in if you want to. She’s my Senator so I’ve sent several rants lately.

  19. MsMass says:

    Copied my name too but disregard that.

  20. bostonboomer says:

    Activists Urge Clinton Campaign to Challenge Election Results in 3 Swing States, by Gabriel Sherman at NY Magazine.


    • Pat Johnson says:

      We definitely need a recount. Russian interference , Wikileaks and Comie rigged this election and we deserve to know.

      Besides, no one would be happier then Trump. He would love to be able to resign.

      • ANonOMouse says:

        I can’t see Hillary challenging the election at this point unless the DOJ gets involved and does the work. Of course it is possible that those machines were sabotaged, but it would have been a lot more doable if the results had been challenged within a couple of days after the election. But 2 weeks on, I don’t see it happening. I also think Hillary will not do it for what she likely believes is the good of the country. This is over and we have to come together to stop whatever batshit crazy things the GOP attempts to pass before the Public begins paying attention. There should be no honeymoon period for Trump, he doesn’t deserve it and the GOP set the precedent for obstruction which might be the route the Dems have to take to stop the really crazy things that Trump and the GOP want to do.

        • Beata says:

          Mouse, I completely agree with you. We need to focus on stopping Trump and the GOP agenda.

        • NW Luna says:

          I believe that challenges must be within a certain period of time after the final results are announced — results in several states are still not finalized.

        • NW Luna says:

          I wouldn’t be surprised if Hillary says Enough is enough from me! but the rest of us need to call, email, protest, rouse everyone we know to Audit the Vote in those states!

        • bostonboomer says:

          The recount would be requested in each state in the normal way. I’m not sure why people think the DOJ would do it.

          • ANonOMouse says:

            I don’t think the DOJ would do it, but I do think the DOJ could order the recount if presented with evidence of tampering.

            From a WaPo article 11/22/16

            “That is not to say the Justice Department would not investigate actual allegations of voter or ballot fraud. Before the election, the department promulgated extensive, real information on the topic and asked those with complaints to report them. They would investigate voter intimidation, election practices that discriminated or other violations of federal law, and would still do so.But they would do it based on actual evidence of violations, rather than intensity of griping over the result.”

    • NW Luna says:

      Call, email, fax, call, email, fax….Repeat!

    • joanelle says:

      Thanks, BB, I was just about to ad that information. Everyone needs to get on this and urge Hillz campaign ‘army’ to also ask for a recount and audit of the computers to identify any monkeying around with them.

  21. jan says:

    I wonder if trump is making these deals etc now because he will be impeached as soon as he is actually in office. I don’t believe there is any other way to remove him until then. Then Pence takes the office of POTUS and the republicans are happy as clams. Not only was it cheating in more ways than one, but essentially a stealth candidate. Perhaps that is why Pence has been doing the ‘presidential’ stance instead of trump.

    • joanelle says:

      And, Jan that is exactly why we need to act now, because this way he may hopefully never get into the Oval Office in the first place. We must act NOW.

    • Beata says:

      Jan, I have had the same thoughts. Pence is a true believer. A real ideologue. Put Pence as POTUS together with a GOP Congress and a sh*tload of far-right legislation will get passed.

  22. Beata says:

    In Resistance to Trump, “Community” Should Be a Verb:

    “Against a Trump regime that is totally unacceptable, we’ll need resistance that’s sustainable. Like a healthy forest, the resistance will depend on great diversity to thrive — a wide range of people engaging in a vast array of activities. And our resistance will need community.

    I’m not talking about the facile gloss of the word “community” that often follows an adjective denoting race, religion, ethnicity or sexual orientation. The kinds of community that will make ongoing resistance possible have little to do with demographic categories. The most powerful, most vital bonding will be transcendently human.

    Facing a Trump presidency, we’ll have an imperative opportunity to go deeper as individuals and groups of people working together — nurturing and growing the social, cultural and political strength that can overcome the Trump regime.

    Our resistance has got to be broadly inclusive, offering and inspiring a great variety of nonviolent tactics and approaches, whether they emerge with a few people around a kitchen table or with many thousands of people at a public protest. The strength of the united front that we need will depend on the extent of truly cooperative efforts.”


  23. Enheduanna says:

    Morning all – I thought this was interesting:


    There are more than 7 million votes uncounted in mostly Democratic areas which Clinton could conceivably win 2 – 1.

  24. William says:

    Somehow this fact needs to become more than the most bitter of footnotes. If Hillary wins by around 3 million votes, that is a sizeable popular mandate. Because of an anti-majoritarian and archaic electoral college system, she may not become President. But the majority and mandate is still there. A distinct minority of voters cannot be allowed to impose their radical right agenda on the majority. All people are equal in rights under our constitution. What we are looking at is not so far from apartheid, the minority using chicanery and force to trample on the rights of the majority. At least I think that is the argument to be made, an argument which legitimizes all forms of attempting to block Republican legislation, voter suppression actions, and appointments. This is so far from a sports event where some strange rule or referee mistake might give the win to the team which didn’t deserve it. That is just a game, and the season continues. This is about America, and its present and future. Hillary got 3 million or more votes more than Trump. People voted for Hillary’s plans and policies, not Trump’s. And I bet that the votes were hacked or suppressed in some way, and that she won by even more than that. We well know that if it happened the other way, the right wing would be taking up arms, and the media would be urging Hillary to abdicate and let the Republicans run the country. Seriously.

  25. NW Luna says:

    J Alex Halderman 11/23:

    Were this year’s deviations from pre-election polls the results of a cyberattack? Probably not. I believe the most likely explanation is that the polls were systematically wrong, rather than that the election was hacked. But I don’t believe that either one of these seemingly unlikely explanations is overwhelmingly more likely than the other…..

    There’s still one way that some of this year’s paper ballots could be examined. In many states, candidates can petition for a recount. The candidate needs to pay the cost, which can run into millions of dollars. The deadlines for filing recount petitions are soon — for example, this Friday in Wisconsin (margin 0.7%), Monday in Pennsylvania (margin 1.2%), and the following Wednesday in Michigan (margin 0.3%).

    Examining the physical evidence in these states — even if it finds nothing amiss — will help allay doubt and give voters justified confidence that the results are accurate. It will also set a precedent for routinely examining paper ballots, which will provide an important deterrent against cyberattacks on future elections. Recounting the ballots now can only lead to strengthened electoral integrity, but the window for candidates to act is closing fast.

    View at Medium.com