Lazy Saturday Reads: Bernie Is For The Birds
Posted: April 2, 2016 | Author: bostonboomer | Filed under: morning reads, U.S. Politics | Tags: Bernie Sanders, Hillary Clinton, New York primary, Wisconsin primary |
Frida Kahlo: Me and My Parrots
Good Afternoon!!
Bernie Sanders sure turned out to be a nasty piece of work. His campaign has devolved into non-stop character attacks on Hillary Clinton, jabs at President Obama, and endless whining about supposed unfair treatment by the media and the Democratic Party.
The latest is Sanders’ outright false claim that the the Clinton campaign has received millions in donations from “the fossil fuel industry.” He may have finally gone too far for the media to keep shielding him.
This time, instead of turning the other cheek, Hillary hit back when a Greenpeace organizer asked her a question based on Sanders’ lies. I’m sure you’ve seen the video of Hillary saying she’s “sick of it.”
Painting by Candido Portinari
Melissa McEwan at Blue Nation Review: THE MOMENT: Why Hillary’s Visible Anger at Being Smeared Spells Big Trouble for Bernie.
The video of Hillary saying, “I am so sick of the Sanders campaign lying about me. I’m sick of it,” is embedded in news stories and is being played all over cable news and the internet. While we take absolutely no issue with the activist’s right to ask the question, we see this as an important inflection point in the 2016 campaign.
There are two ways the story is being covered. In some places, the video (or just Hillary’s quote) is being shared with little commentary beyond some description of her being angry, usually accompanied by the note that she “jabbed” her finger. This coverage treats the fact of Hillary’s demonstrable anger as the entire story.
And, in the sense that Hillary has been pressured to conceal her emotion—indeed her very humanity—by a media and commentariat who have, for decades, unscrupulously policed her every expression and every turn of phrase, the fact that she refused to abide the unwinnable rules they’ve set for her, is newsworthy all on its own.
But, of course, that is not the real story.
Other media outlets, more responsible ones, are using the incident to actually research and report on Hillary’s statement that Bernie, his staff, his surrogates, and his supporters have lied about her. Repeatedly.
These journalists are digging into the numbers, and finding that, in fact, the insinuation that she has accepted money from the “fossil fuel industry” (or any other industry for that matter) has no justification. It is a smear by innuendo.
Monica Bellucci in Dolce & Gabbana Photography by Signe Vilstrup Harper’s Bazaar Ukraine
There have been a number of stories about this, some of which McEwan cites in her post.
From Washington Post fact-checker Glenn Kessler:
Who’s right in the Democratic spat over oil-industry contributions? A lot depends on what is counted –and how it is counted. Clinton made a strong accusation that the Sanders campaign is “lying” about the issue. Let’s see whether the Sanders campaign’s math hold up.
This all started when a Greenpeace activist approached Clinton on a rope line to ask her to “reject fossil-fuel money in the future” in her campaign. As a matter of law, campaigns are prohibited from taking money directly from corporations, though the Clinton campaign has not received money from oil-industry PACs either.
As Clinton noted in her angry response, she does get money from people who work at oil companies. (These calculations involve people who contribute at least $200 and provide an occupation or employer.) According to the Center for Responsive Politics, as of March 21, the Clinton campaign has received nearly $308,000 for individuals in the oil and gas industry. The Sanders campaign has received nearly $54,000.
In you include contributions from outside groups supporting a candidate, Clinton’s total increases slightly to $333,000, compared to Sanders’ $54,000. Compared to Republicans, Democrats have received just a pittance from the fossil-fuel industry: 2.3 percent of oil and gas contributions in this election cycle. That should be no surprise, given that both Clinton and Sanders have been critical of the oil and gas industry — and have targeted it for higher taxes or reduced loopholes.
Painting by Meghan Howland
You can read more details at the WaPo link, but the conclusion is:
The Sanders campaign is exaggerating the contributions that Clinton has received from the oil and gas industry. In the context of her overall campaign, the contributions are hardly significant. It’s especially misleading to count all of the funds raised by lobbyists with multiple clients as money “given” by the fossil-fuel industry.
Some substantive media responses to check out:
Philip Bump: Why Hillary Clinton is justifiably annoyed by criticism of her Big Oil fundraising.
Steve Benen: Money from Big Oil isn’t always what it appears to be.
John Aravosis: Factchecker: 3 Pinocchios for Sanders over Clinton oil & gas donations.
And can you believe that Sanders actually had the timerity to demand an apology from Clinton? Danny Freeman and Monica Alba at MSNBC: Bernie Sanders: Hillary Clinton owes me an apology over ‘lies’ claim.
That was before the fact checker article came out. But the Clinton campaign said they weren’t about to apologize for calling out Sanders’ lies.
Sanders was also upset that Clinton criticized him for dismissing reproductive rights as a side issue when compared to income inequality, the minimum wage, and his other preferred (in an interview with Rachel Maddow). So in a speech in Wisconsin yesterday, he claimed to be listening to women.
Whoops! This man is no feminist folks, no matter what he and his supporters think.
For Frida, by Sheri Howe
The Wisconsin primary is on Tuesday, and tonight both Democratic candidates will speak at the Democratic Founders Day Dinner in Milwaukee tonight at 7PM. I wonder if there will be fireworks? C-Span is going to live stream it, and maybe other cable networks will too. The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel reports that early voting in the state has been heavy.
Of course the big prize will be the New York primary on April 19. Remember when Bernie’s campaign claimed that Hillary was refusing to debate him in New York? It turns out he’s the one dodging a debate there.
CBS News reports, Clinton campaign: Bernie Sanders is delaying scheduling New York debate.
Hillary Clinton’s campaign said Saturday that it has suggested three potential dates for an additional Democratic debate in New York, but all of those dates were rejected by Bernie Sanders and his aides….
Sanders’ campaign has been publicly challenging Clinton to agree to a debate in New York ahead of the state’s primary, which both candidates are eager to win as they compete for the Democratic nomination. According to Fallon, in the past week, the Clinton campaign offered the night of April 4, the night of April 14 and the morning of April 15 as potential dates to meet for a debate.
Past debates this cycle have been nighttime events, but Fallon said the morning option was offered after Sanders agreed to debate on that day on Good Morning America.
“That, too, was rejected,” Fallon said.
The night of April 14 and the morning of April 15 are still on the table.
“The Sanders campaign needs to stop using the New York primary as a playground for political games and negative attacks against Hillary Clinton,” Fallon said. “The voters of New York deserve better. Senator Sanders and his team should stop the delays and accept a debate on April 14 or the morning of April 15th.”
Little Green Bee Eaters of Upper Egypt, by Sushila Burgess
The Sanders campaign rejected the April 4th date because of competition from the NCAA basketball championship, but
In a tweet Saturday, Fallon said the Clinton campaign had “offered a time” that ensured the debate would end “before tipoff.”
Does Bernie want to debate or not? It’s not clear. If he does, Hillary will come out on top, so maybe he’s afraid.
Speaking of journalists finally beginning to vet Bernie Sanders, check out this AP piece by Ken Thomas: Clinton, Sanders had opposing views on biomedical research.
Clinton has pointed to her advocacy for groundbreaking medical research, from her push for more dollars as a New York senator for the National Institutes of Health to her long support for stem cell research that could eventually lead to regenerative medicine.
Sanders, a Vermont senator, has supported stem cell research in the Senate. But advocates within the scientific community cite his voting record in the early 2000s in the House when he repeatedly supported a ban on all forms of human cloning, including one called therapeutic cloning intended to create customized cells to treat disease.
“We were looking for signs that he is going to be a supporter of what science and technology can do and I think everyone in the country ought to be worried about that,” said Dr. Harold Varmus, the Nobel Prize-winning former NIH director under President Bill Clinton.
“I am quite concerned about his stance on these issues,” Varmus said. “This is a litmus test. It was 10 years ago — it’s still a test that he failed in the view of many of us….”
While serving in the House, Sanders voted to ban therapeutic cloning in 2001, 2003 and 2005 as Congress grappled with the ethics of biotechnology and scientific advances. Patient advocacy groups note that Sanders co-sponsored bans in 2003 and 2005 that included criminal penalties for conducting the research and opposed alternatives that would have allowed the cloning of embryos solely for medical research.
Clinton, meanwhile, co-sponsored legislation in 2001 and 2002 in the Senate that would have expanded stem cell research and co-sponsored a bill in 2005 that would have banned human cloning while protecting the right of scientists to conduct stem cell research.
Sanders said following a vote in 2001 that he had “very serious concerns about the long-term goals of an increasingly powerful and profit-motivated biotechnology industry.” In a later vote, he warned of the dangers of “owners of technology” who are “primarily interested in how much money they can make rather than the betterment of society.”
Oil painting by Indian artist Ilayaraja
For Sanders, it’s always about corporations not people. And guess who was on Bernie’s side on this issue?
“Sanders and (then Republican House Majority Leader Tom) DeLay…were just unyielding and they were part of the religious right’s attempt to shut down this whole critical new frontier of therapy for chronic disease,” said Robert Klein, chairman of the California Institute for Regenerative Medicine.
“It’s fine to say you’re for stem cell research but you vote against it and you vote against all therapeutic application, it doesn’t mean anything to say you’re for it,” Klein said. “Fine, he votes for it years later when it’s more popular and the pressure is off. We needed leadership then.”
Bernie did say in his Young Turks interview that “I’m not that big into being a “leader”… I’d much rather prefer to see a lot of leaders and a lot of grassroots activism.” Well, the President of the United States has to be a leader. He or she can’t just respond to the dictates of the “grassroots.”
Finally, here’s a good piece at The Atlantic on why voting for Hillary isn’t just about her being a woman.
Stoke by Nayland Church, by Sir Cedric Morris
Li Zhou: More Than Just a Symbol. Millennial women resent being told to vote for Clinton because she’s a woman. That’s why they should look at her career fighting for women.
At a February rally for Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire, actress Emily Ratajkowski said just that when explaining her support for the Vermont senator: “I want my first female president to be more than a symbol. I want her to have politics that can revolutionize.” In a piece by my colleague Molly Ball, one woman interviewed about Sanders took this position one step further, saying Sanders is “‘more pro-woman’ than Clinton.” And in a recent Politico article, Molly Roberts lamented that, for Millennials, Clinton’s gender is “simply not enough to make her a groundbreaker.” ….
But are Millennials really being asked to support Clinton for no reason other than to shatter the glass ceiling? Unfortunately, because that message has been repeatedly linked to Clinton’s campaign—yet never directly espoused by it—its noise obscures the deeper reasons that young women should support Clinton. It’s not just that she’s a woman; it’s that she has fought for women her whole career.
For decades, Clinton has prioritized bills and policies promoting reproductive rights, equal pay, and family leave—far more so than Sanders. This is not to say that Sanders has not supported such legislation or practices. The key difference is that, for him, they simply haven’t been as much of a priority.
Read the rest at the link.
What stories are you following today? Please post your thoughts and links in the comment thread and have a great weekend!
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I’m extra lazy today!
It was worth the wait. Very informative and the pix are beautiful! I really can’t wait until Sanders goes away and I hope the DNC will focus on primaring him. He’s a selfish ass.
Thanks! I would also love to see him primaried.
After the Frida Kahlo painting at the top, my favorite is the photo from Harper’s Bazaar Ukraine.
I like the little girl in the sari
Wow, great post, BB, very informative!
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Al is in Wisconsin!
Great post on the Sanders sleaze, and how Hillary’s record shows her strength. Any authentic Democrat should be calling out the Republicans, not slandering his Democratic competition.
Love the colorful paintings too.
Sanders, now a reformer, once boasted of being tough on crime https://www.yahoo.com/politics/sanders-now-a-reformer-once-boasted-of-being-223600102.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=tw via @YahooPolitics
Bernie Slanders
#ImWithHer pic.twitter.com/owG3QXoqNq
h/t to VotingHillary @ Uppity’s
David Cay Johnston: Why Hasn’t Bernie Sanders Released His Tax Returns? (Or Cruz Or Kasich, Either…)
http://www.nationalmemo.com/why-hasnt-bernie-sanders-released-his-tax-returns/
Johnson is currently getting the Bernie bro treatment on Twitter . . .
That article is a must read!
Isn’t that interesting? The more I learn about this slime ball the less I like him.
Slippery candidate! Wish I knew about this before I had to caucus.
I wish more would be asked about what he said to Cenk Uygur on Young Turks earlier this week: “I’m not big into being a leader”! Then why BS are you running to be the head of the executive branch of our government? POTUS is a leadership job, by definition. If you seriously mean what you say BS, then what is your notion of leadership and how will that be effective for the good of the American people, our national interests, and our global relationships?
To be an agitator can be an honorable role, but not usually well suited for executive responsibilities. Perhaps the rhetoric of ‘creative disruption’ has gone to BS’s head.
I agree. Can you imagine the uproar if Clinton had said those words? He gets a pass on so much, it’s quite frustrating.
Good list: http://www.thepeoplesview.net/main/2016/3/31/berning-questions-15-key-concerns-of-the-american-people-that-bernie-sanders-needs-to-address
It is, but I didn’t care for the questions on religion. I thought they were way too personal and no one’s business.
I loved the question on religion because it illustrates how Bernie hides or dodges things he doesn’t want to address. He hasn’t had the nerve to come right out and say what I believe to be true, that he’s an atheist. As everyone here already knows I personally have no issue with that, but Bernie knows the American people aren’t likely to elect an atheist, anymore than they’re likely to elect an independent Socialist. Bernie only began to identify himself as a Democrat Socialist when he joined the Presidential race. Since then he has worked hard to soften his socialist image, but if you look at his socialist roots in the Liberty Union Party you will see that the brand of socialism Bernie pushed was anti-capitalism and that he spent much of his life supporting government control of industry. There is no way he could be elected, or even have received the support he currently has, if he had been properly vetted. The MSM let us down. The Hillary haters ignored his past because they didn’t/don’t want Hillary to be POTUS. Let’s hope we can shut his mouth in the upcoming primaries and run him out of the race once and for all.
Great comment, Mouse. I especially liked this:
This country is way too religious in spite of the separation of church and State – I agree with what you wrote: he’s not ready to state, without a doubt, that he is an atheist. I, too, have zero problem with that, but so many other citizens would not be ready to vote for him. The mention of “liberal” causes apoplexy – atheism would cause self destruction.
I have a big roll of duct tape to shut his mouth, if you need it. 🙂
I’ll just be glad when we get past WI (even if she loses, I don’t think it will be by much) and WY and into the primaries in NY,DE,RI,MD and PA on the 19th and 26th. I’m tired of seeing and listening to Bernie, he’s so shrill. 🙂
I can’t wait till the 26 Apr.
Can I help you with that duct tape? Please, please!
I agree whole heartedly with everything you said. It’s been pissing me off this entire campaign that the word “Democratic” suddenly appeared in front of “socialist” and he started saying that meant he was just like FDR and everyone went along with it! Nobody asked him why all of a sudden he became less radical. The MSM has been shameful throughout this race.
Great article. Respectful but insightful questions. I would like to think that just as some of the news media is now asking tougher questions of Trump, they will turn their focus to Sanders.
I would like to have seen more questions on his so called support of Women’s Liberation. I just don’t think he was involved in the women’s movement, maybe became was sympathic, but I have never known him to be in our communities, back in the day. I’ve never seen him with a photo of Angela Davis either, and she leaned socialistic. I’ve never heard him pay in encouraging words to those of us worked to put Roe Vs. Wade, never heard him talk about women health matters either. I want to see and hear his discussions on the issues back then, and into 21st century.
I love that he’s asking many of the same questions I would ask if I had the chance. I’m particularly interested in knowing why a person who frames himself as a lifelong civil rights activist moved to snow flake VT? As BB told me land was cheap in VT in the early 60’s. Yes, maybe he was a back to the land enthusiast, but a person who was morally aligned with Civil Rights activism wouldn’t move to VT and disappear for 15 years. That simply makes no sense. Land was very cheap in Mississippi & Alabama in the 60’s that would have been a great place for Bernie to get back to the land and practice his dedication to the Civil Rights movement.
Bernie Sanders is a fraud and I’m disgusted that the MSM hasn’t done their job and exposed his hypocrisy and duplicity. When this is over, he needs to be sent packing back to Vermont.
I just read this article, which I saw on Twitter, and loved it.
At rallies, Hillary Clinton’s supporters are looking for logic, not passion
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/at-rallies-hillary-clintons-supporters-are-looking-for-logic/2016/04/02/4098c502-f73f-11e5-a3ce-f06b5ba21f33_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_hillaryrally-1221pm:homepage/story
I loved this article and hoping I am not posting it twice – my first try seems to have disappeared!
At rallies, Hillary Clinton’s supporters are looking for logic, not passion
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/at-rallies-hillary-clintons-supporters-are-looking-for-logic/2016/04/02/4098c502-f73f-11e5-a3ce-f06b5ba21f33_story.html?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_hillaryrally-1221pm:homepage/story
Thanks for linking that, it was great.
Thanks so much for posting this! And dakinikat too. This is EXACTLY me and my reasons for supporting her.
Plus I’m unbelievably sick of hearing Clinton’s supporters aren’t enthusiastic. Just because we don’t revel in the race to the bottom of negative attention-seeking behavior and rage like Trump and Sanders fans does not mean we lack enthusiasm. I am seeing more pieces like this so I think other supporters are starting to speak out too.
I get excited by wonkiness! Hey, that’s a great bumper sticker — I may make one up with a Hillary “H” next to it. 😀
I keep going into Spam for some reason. Can you get out my last comment?
Sorry, Delphyne. I don’t know why that happened.
Thanks for rescuing me!
yw!
I wish that more voters actually cast their ballots based on a careful study of the issues and the canddiates’ histories and proposals. However, I am inclined to think that many voters follow the campaign that the media invites them to; one which is all about the visuals, or the narratives the media prefers. The example that you brought up above, where various networks simply showed Hillary being angry at some member of the audience (sometimes they did not even show the question the activist asked); or perhaps the media person saying that Hillary was angry about a question regarding contributions from the oil and gas industry, well illustrates this. All many of the voters know is that Hillary got angry; and that she is accused of taking contributions from fossil fuel companies. She got angry because she first had to endure a bunch of Sanders people who deliberately came to her rally to chant slogans demeaning her; and then met an activist who didn’t just ask something in a collegial manner, but in an accusatory one, undoubtedly hoping that this would get on the news. That’s the context that is may be going past many voters.
Sanders’ campaign is becoming more hostile and sneaky by the day. The media mostly lets him get away with this; he is essentially portrayed as “Sanders the Incorruptible” (the appellation that was once accorded to Robespierre). But he is devious, accusatory; sends out people to disrupt his opponent’s rallies; lies about all sorts of things. He is a holier-than-thou political puritan, and that is why none of his Senate colleagues support him.
Yep. I don’t know how many friends & acquaintances have told me “I don’t get into the details of political stuff much with the candidates.” To which I reply with some version of “I want to know what they’ve done, what they’ve said, and how it compares with what they’re promising now. How else can you decide except based on the evidence?”
I’m so glad Hillary has finally begun to fight back. Bernie has said and implied the most vile things about Hillary and they’ve mostly gone unchallenged by the campaign. If the reason was to avoid offending the Berners, that’s a waste of time. It’s been my observation that they hate Hillary and aren’t reluctant to use lies and innuendo to support their hatred. My feeling is that there is nothing Hillary could do to win their support, so defend yourself Hillary.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/at-rallies-hillary-clintons-supporters-are-looking-for-logic/2016/04/02/4098c502-f73f-11e5-a3ce-f06b5ba21f33_story.html
Great story on us vs the thrilled/stupid cult followers
OK to have debate April 14 or 15 because 2016 tax deadline is April 18th.
It looks like Bernie really doesn’t want to debate. I can understand why, because it would be a New York audience and Hillary would mop the floor with him.
That’s right, extra day since 15th is Friday?
Haven’t blogged since 2008 but have been following this one since then. I am concerned that the Bernie followers are still fighting and carrying on. They are raising money and it gaining traction in NY based on the latest polls. Am crossing my fingers that Hill can clinch the nomination sooner than later!
Haven’t blogged since 2008 but have been following this one. I am concerned that the Bernie supporters are continuing to fund his campaign and that the polls in NY are getting closer. I hope Hill can clinch the nomination sooner than later.
In an op-ed, a Utah superdelegate explains why she supports Clinton. The piece already has several comments from Sanders supporters.
http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/3722261-155/op-ed-i-am-honoring-my-responsibility
The Democratic dinner in Milwaukee is supposed to be on C-Span 1, but it’s not on as of now. Maybe it’s starting late.
It’s on now. I’m not going to put up a live blog because no one else seems interested. If we need one later, I’ll do a fresh thread.
I watched it too and I thought Hillary did an excellent job. Bernie was same old, same old bernie.
That was one of the greatest speeches I’ve seen Hillary give. She is really getting good at this campaigning thing.
I’m glad she’s back on point and focusing her attention on the differences between her and Bernie. When she does that she’s so much more powerful. Bernie is still her opponent not Trump. I’m glad she mentioned Trump & Cruz, but she has to put away bernie first. Even though the berners in the back were screaming and trying to start a “bernie, bernie” chant, I didn’t think the crowd reacted nearly as well for Bernie as they did Hillary. I believe they gave her 4 standing O’s.
I didn’t hear the screaming, but the audience was quite unenthusiastic for Bernie and the opposite for Hillary. But why not? They’re Democrats.
I missed it.
You can still watch it on C-Span.
I thought her speech tonight was authentic, strong, and very well tailored to the issues Wisconsin is facing. She drew sharp contrasts between BS and her candidacy while sticking to the high road. She was Presidential, again. No other current candidate compares. Doing it “backwards and in high heels.”
Video intro starts at 1:16:50 and then her speech:
http://www.c-span.org/video/?407537-1/wisconsin-democratic-party-founders-day-gala
Wish more younger women could see that video, her speech at the UN Women’s Conference in Bejing shifted global consciousness and changed lives. There’s a reason why she’s been named most admired woman in America 20 different times. She earned it.
Something besides the obvious was bothering me about him asking for an apology. It hit me: have you ever heard a male politician asked to say I’m sorry? It reminds me of an abuse situation where the woman is forced to be submissive.
Bernie may be for the birds, but apparently he just won Nevada. Some Sanders delegates are telling me that not enough Clinton delegates showed up in Clark Co and she lost by 560 votes.
Those are county delegates not state.
How is this possible, I thought the election was over? I see Sanders has a petition on MoveOn.org accusing Hillary Clinton of election fraud? Exactly how long are people going to keep turning the other way and let BerNARD Sanders continue these attacks without a response.
He didn’t win NV, this entire thing is being blown out of proportion by the bernie supporters. Apparently Clark County had their County Meeting today and more of Bernie’s delegates showed than Hillary’s so he ended up with more delegate votes. There were some credentialing problems too and from what I’ve read this might mean a difference of 1 delegate. Still, the State Democratic Convention isn’t until May, so this likely will not stand.
No. He didn’t win. The woman who was removed today shared Clinton’s data with Sanders campaign. Someone also sent out messages to Clinton delegates that they didn’t need to show up today. This is not final. Hillary can get the delegates back at the convention. Caucuses are idiotic.
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I agree BB. That fiasco in Clark County didn’t overturn the results of the election, no matter how hard the berners try to make others believe that. I read last night that it might mean a difference of a delegate going to the State Convention which is sometime in May. Even then it might not make any difference whatsoever. I think it will get ironed out at the State Convention, so it’s not something I feel any concern about. Leave it to the berners to try to steal a State he lost
Here is the latest I have: http://lasvegassun.com/news/2016/apr/02/sanders-wins-most-delegates-at-clark-county-conven/
This is why it can be so difficult. In Feb Nevada voted by precinct standing in a room and counting heads. During more standing around some more, those voted are counted and a number of delegates are counted to represent the proportion of votes to candidates. Then a month or sometimes some months later those delegates assemble in another room and stand around to be counted. Based on that count the proportion of pledged convention delegates are determined. If folks don’t show up or change sides, or are miscounted the delegate count will be different. Lots of single moms or folks who can’t get off work or who get the flu will miss out because this process can take a full day each time, with travel, parking babysitting, etc.
.
I read the same article from the LasVegas Sun. And I agree with you. The caucus process is totally undemocratic, but what’s even more undemocratic are the Sanders supporters trying to steal the State of NV from Hillary. Sanders has run a campaign of Anger and Resentment and it’s driving some of his supporters to behave poorly. Hillary needs to ramp it up and get Bernie out of this race ASAP.
I don’t know what the hell is going on, but this is some back handed bullshit. Am I suppose to believe that all of sudden they all threw their support to Sanders? I think the DNC needs to call Bernie in for some discussions, and Hillary needs to lawyer up. This guy is desperate.
Either folks were shut out or they couldn’t get off work, or? In any event, fewer Hillary folks were in the convention room. My Sanders delegate friend and his wife is telling me that they were there for around 4 hours. A recount was called at the end of that and it was shouted down. They were 560 Hillary votes short to the tie. I don’t think you can keep that many people outside the door.
Some Hillary people couldn’t get into the room, because Bernie bros packed the hall. Police had to be called to get unauthorized people out. In addition, someone sent instructions to Hillary people that they didn’t need to come.
Yes, I heard there were what 630 unauthorized delegates counted; I don’t know who for.
http://heavy.com/news/2016/04/bernie-sanders-wins-nevada-flips-clark-county-convention-las-vegas-delegates-arrested-clinton-videos/
No, Bernie did not win NV.
What info have you got BB?
I posted info above in a reply to Mouse.
Please read the tweets I posted above from Hillary’s campaign manager. She will still have more delegates from NV. Bernie cheated. Nothing new. It will come back to haunt him.
This guy on Twitter has a lot of detailed info on NV caucuses. This could all change in May at the convention, but Hillary still has more delegates after today.
https://twitter.com/Taniel/with_replies
There are two different things going on here. One is the Berners’ claim that he’s now won NV. That is a flat out lie and has been creditably refuted by many people.
The other is that Bernie’s people were successful in taking delegates from Clinton. I have read everything I could find (including the LV Sun article and Ralston). It’s very unclear with a lot of contradictory information about the process.
The best I can tell is that while there is a possibility that the delegate shift could be ameliorated at the May convention, there’s no indication I can find that that is likely to happen. Just the opposite, in fact, since now there are many more Bernie country delegates going to the state convention than Clinton delegates.
There is no way to tell how many potential delegates didn’t show up on Sat. due to the Clark County Credentials Chair’s misleading email telling them they didn’t need to attend. She is a Sanders supporter. The Clinton campaign was concerned enough about her behavior prior to Saturday to have their lawyer send a letter requesting her removal, based on both her release of their confidential campaign information to Sanders staff and other issues. I doubt they do that very often. The Chair was ultimately removed, but not until after the damage was done.
Clinton started with an NV delegate lead of 20-15, but after Saturday, she only leads by 1, 18-17 due to the Clark County convention mess. Clinton won NV by at 6 points, and Clark Country by 10. This is the part that concerns me, because there’s no indication it is likely to be reversed in May, just speculation that it could be.
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Luna and I have been caucus delegates at the initial caucus and then on to the countywide caucus and I can tell you that what happened in Clarke County absolutely could happen but this all still really surprises me. The countywide convention is even worse than the caucus because it lasts for 10 to 12 hours and you cannot leave the building. If you were savvy enough to pack food and water for yourself you’d be fine but most people don’t do that during their first convention. Sometimes party leaders have a supply of bottled water for people, sometimes they don’t. It’s really grueling and can easily be manipulated but I am shocked and disgusted at the fact that people were told not to come.
As horrific as this is, it seems the Clinton people have a handle on it but I wonder what the hell we can expect during the general election against Trump? *shudders*
I’m glad I’ve never had to do that. There’s been no point in my life where a caucus would have been a convenient experience for me, so I can imagine how demanding it is on many people.
In 2008 the names of the 2 Hillary delegates (me and spouse) “somehow” got dropped off the list which went to the County caucus. So I was told when we showed up. We did make them take us.
I would not be surprised at all for shenanigans to happen this year. Caucus delegates are allowed to switch sides at most of the levels as the whole scheme pyramids on up to the state level There is opportunity for the unscrupulous to try to take the place of another candidate’s delegates.
Caucuses are not only very undemocratic, but they virtually encourage cheating. The people who set them up must be deluded do-gooders. “Oh, this will be fun! It will encourage real-life participation, like it was in the 1800’s!” But what they do is make it impossible for people who don’t want to stand for ten hours in a hot room of contentious people, to attend. And then when they do, they get cheated by unscrupulous people. So of course the next time they will have nothing to do with it, leaving only the unscrupulous to participate. The frightening truth is that if all 50 states had caucuses, Sanders would be the nominee. And every Republican nominee
would be an Evangelical. The Nazis, or a variant of them, could get themselves nominated by either party if there were only caucuses. That the DNC allows this is astounding and deplorable. But they got the result they wanted last time because of them, so that must be why they are still there.
I agree 100%, William.
A heartbreaking story about the religious fanatics in TX who think they have the right to force women to adhere to some absurd religiously motivated dictate.
http://www.politicususa.com/2016/04/01/cruel-texas-republicans-force-women-deliver-dead-babies.html
Bwahahaha!
LOL…..That was great!
Sorry Bernie, I was looking for a place to poop and you looked like a good spot!
I know I’m not voting for a corporate shill like Hillary who has been show she and Bill have been bought and paid for by corporate interests for forty years. I have principals and they aren’t the same as a bunch of corporate executives who want to destroy the middle class of America..
and what proof do you have of that?
40 years and 4 billion dollars she and Bill received in corporate bri oh sorry contributions.
You mean the Clinton Foundation? You have a thing against helping African babies with AIDS? Wow. If I look up your name in the dictionary is it under gullible? She’s released all her tax records unlike the other faux Dem in the race. He probably doesn’t want them released since his wife does them and she already committed accounting fraud that took down a college.
Oh, so sorry that discussing the facts gets called changing the subject. Take your fake concern and insults along with your vagueries elsewhere.