Women under Carriages, under Street Cars, and under Buses

Abigail AdamsIf particular care and attention is not paid to the ladies we are determined to foment a rebellion, and will not hold ourselves bound by any laws in which we have no voice or representation.”

Important anniversaries are on us. This quote by the second first lady of the United States, Abigail Adams,  is as fresh and pertinent as it was when  she penned this in a letter to her husband in 1776.

From the birth of this country down to present day, women are the forgotten citizens. When they assert their rights, some war, some other movement, a disease, some other man or even the rights of proto-humans are placed before them and many just fall in.  We take care of our gay brothers suffering from aids while the last few states fail to ratify the ERA.  We support the abolition movement to free and give rights to Black Americans and votes to black men while we’re considered property way into the 1970s and cannot achieve the vote until 1920.  We march.  We do all the behind the scene work and organizing.  Then, when we ask for the vote, for our place in governing, for our right to lead, we are told that would be expedient to larger movements.  This is true of black civil rights movements, labor movements, peace movements or antiwar movements, and the founding of our nation and so ad infinitum.

We are not only approaching our annual celebration of Independence Day.  We have come upon the 160th anniversary of the Seneca Falls Convention.  The women who met during that July suggested this addition to the Declaration of Independence and penned their own tome the Declaration of Sentiments.

It was signed by a number of women leaders  including Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Lucretia Mott. The first women’s rights conference in the United States Convention was held in Seneca Falls, New York on July 19 and 20, 1848.  Few will be celebrating this historic gathering  or probably even know of it.   One hundred and sixty years after the convention, the equality that Elizabeth Cady Stanton demands still eludes us.Susan B Anthony and Elizabeth Cady Stanton

“The eloquent Frederick Douglass, a former slave and now editor of the Rochester North Star, however, swayed the gathering into agreeing to the resolution. At the closing session, Lucretia Mott won approval of a final resolve “for the overthrowing of the monopoly of the pulpit, and for the securing to woman equal participation with men in the various trades, professions and commerce.”

Source:  http://www.npg.si.edu/col/seneca/senfalls1.htm

This is the same Frederick Douglass who later threw women under the carriage for Black male suffrage.  In 1869, an amendment was proposed to Congress that guarantees “The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of race, color, or previous condition of servitude.”

Douglass told women to wait since it was easier to get the proposed amendment through congress if it guaranteed black males the right to vote, but not women.  This is exactly what happened.  Women had to wait.

For over two centuries, American women had few civil or political rights. Wives had to do what they were told by their husband. Until 1884, a wife was officially listed as one of her husband’s possessions. Women stayed slaves for years after the emancipation proclamation was signed.

When I was at university, I noticed this strange pattern.  Every time women say it is our turn to be recognized for all this work and we  deserve equal pay, equal rights, and equal respect,  men change the subject and put some other movement in between us.  If you look through history,  many women’s rights movements have been cast aside for peace movements or labor movements and later for civil rights movements that basically favored the rights of gay men or black men.

When asked what the role of women was in the Black Panther Movement, the answer was:  “The only role for women in this movement is horizontal.”  This continual divide and conquer strategy has left us waiting at bus stops for buses that we are later thrown under.  Much of the impetus of the women’s movement in the 70s was distilled to civil rights for gays after Stonewall and the Aids crisis.  Gay bashing and Aids struck gay men hard but much of the work and nursing was done by lesbians who abandoned the fight for the ERA and protection of the sanctity of women’s individuality as the religious right’s attempts to water down Roe v. Wade increased the humanity of proto-human life while decreasing that of breathing, living women.

The odd thing is that none of these movements are bad causes.  The development of a democratic nation, peace, abolition, Aids research, or suffrage for black men all have merit.  The fact that these are ALL good causes is not what bothers me.  The larger point to me is that these movements sprung up during active women’s rights movements and suddenly took precedence.

Senator Shirley Chisholm has always been one of my personal heroines and clearly recognized that women’s rights were not a priority for this nation.  She was always quick to note that she had experienced more sexism in her life than racism.   Please read what this great champion of women’s rights said as she fought for passage of the ERA.

Mr. Speaker, House Joint Resolution 264, before us today, which provides for equality under the law for both men and women, represents one of the most clear-cut opportunities we are likely to have to declare our faith in the principles that shaped our Constitution. It provides a legal basis for attack on the most subtle, most pervasive, and most institutionalized form of prejudice that exists. Discrimination against women, solely on the basis of their sex, is so widespread that is seems to many persons normal, natural and right.

Legal expression of prejudice on the grounds of religious or political belief has become a minor problem in our society. Prejudice on the basis of race is, at least, under systematic attack. There is reason for optimism that it will start to die with the present, older generation. It is time we act to assure full equality of opportunity to those citizens who, although in a majority, suffer the restrictions that are commonly imposed on minorities, to women.

Source: http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/shirleychisholmequalrights.htm

Whenever women make progress, men step in with some other distraction and create disunity.  I see this same pattern today in the Democratic Party ONE HUNDRED and SIXTY years after the Seneca Falls Convention and well over TWO HUNDRED years after Abigail Adams.

Women, please stop and think about this before you donate your time to peace movements, misc. civil rights movements, ANY kind of movement.  We are the work horses of all of these movements, yet how many of these movements turn around and provide us ANYTHING  but lip service?  Think of the DNC, what have they done recently to stop the hemorrhage of reproductive rights?  support equal pay laws?  stop SEXIST attacks on women candidates?  Which women in this system (yes, YOU Nancy Pelosi, yes, You Candy Crowely, yes, you Cindy Sheehan, yes, you Donna Brazille, yes YOU, Governor Sibilius, yes YOU Senator Mary Landrieu, yes you Secretary of State Rice,yes, YOU Gloria Borger, …) will willingly sell out their own sex to be acceptable to the boys and get recognition in a movement or a profession not of our own design whose rules are set up so that we ultimately fail.

Just THINK ABOUT IT when you celebrate this Fourth of July.   Look at your daughters, your mothers, your grandmothers, your granddaughters, and the women around you and THINK about it.  What movement did I join that stopped me from asking for basic human and democratic rights for women?  Think about what happened to Hillary Clinton this primary season and ASK yourselves will you compromise YET again?

How much is that compromise worth to you?

38 Comments on “Women under Carriages, under Street Cars, and under Buses”

  1. kenoshaMarge says:

    I’ve heard what you said before. But I’ve never heard it said better.

    It is obvious that the words came straight from your heart. And they echo the words and thoughts I’ve been saying all my life.

    There are not enough men in this country to stop the ERA. Women out-number them. So we know, we see that the ones who stop equal rights for women, are women.

    We are fortunate that a lot of wonderful decent men join us in our fight against misogny. Now if only other women would so the same. It is disgusting.

  2. Ani says:

    Thank you so much for this post. The most significant thing here is the modern women, like the Borgers, Mitchells, Dowds, Pelosis etc, who sell out their own sex to line up with the boys — see — don’t beat me up cause I’ll help you throw rocks at Hillary, too.


    When will men stop selling women out?

    When will some women stop selling themselves out just to please some men?

    The lovely progressive men who side with us in all this, are of course, profoundly thanked, and exlcuded from this criticism. As are all the women who hold on to their principles, even when they become inconvenient.

  3. adamonis says:

    I was going to pass on commenting because it required me to give a frank confession. I closed my browser and went back to Blue’s, only to reopen my browser back to your blog. I will post my confession here.

    I think the entire reason that women’s rights get the back burner treatment is women ourselves. My entire life conditions me to put other people first. It was virtuous to care for others before yourself from the time I was a 2 year old child with a baby brother, and later a baby sister. I was not allowed to think of myself first. Money was tight when I grew up, and certain things had to be considered, first for my father, the breadwinner, and then my brother because he was “the boy”. I was told that it was just the way it was.

    Having a boyfriend meant suppressing what I liked in order to be the “best” choice for that particular boy. Having a husbamd meant that I always acted on his best interests, not mine. Even in a divorce, I considered him first because I knew that I was smart enough to get by, and he was not as fortunate.

    As a co-worker and supervisor, I always admired the man who helped with his family, and went out of my way to give that person whatever assistance they needed, uncredited of course.

    I have moved out of the way for men my entire life, and a little voice inside me says that it is all right to do that. Of course I want equal pay, but I know that will never happen, so I just work twice as hard and extra so that I can have a well-paying job. I know that I am not the ony woman out there that feels this way.

    I do not know if this comment will help your analysis, but I feel better for speaking my truth, no matter how insignificant this truth makes me feel.

  4. Heidi Li says:

    dakinkat: Thank you for this. When women work together for the sake of their common good immediate benefits turn up. Your post saves every one of us who would have wanted to express similar thoughts (but probably would not have managed to so as eloquently did) can now make every effort to make your post go EVERYWHERE. First stop

    Thank you, again!

  5. Delphyne says:

    “The larger point to me is that these movements sprung up during active womens rights movements and suddenly took precedence.”

    Huzzah! Wonderful post, Dakinikat. Women rights are human rights – life is born from women, movements are born from women. I think that when women realize that the boys club doesn’t have to be the only club around, they might stop pimping and/or selling out their sisters.

    I often thought of ECStanton and FDouglass during this campaign and saw history repeating itself again. Obama must be president first and then, and only then, can Hillary be “allowed” to be president. I say, not this time and never again.

  6. Delphyne says:

    Adamonis, I know what you are saying, having been there for most of my 58 years. Oldest child of 8, tight money, mother who thought that women didn’t really have any other choice but to defer to men. I remember her saying to me that it was great to be smart, but don’t let men see that you are smarter than them because they won’t “like” you.

    I have fought against that tyranny for about half of my life – the other half went along with it, even though I was angry so much of the time. It wasn’t until I got divorced and really took a long hard look at my psyche that I started to openly rebel. At that time, I started reading feminist books – political and spiritual – and have stayed on that path, in spite of other of life’s numerous distractions. It’s not easy; it scares many people who want to know why “you’re so angry” and “you complain all of the time.” I usually ask them, “Do you ever really think what it means to be a woman in any patriarchal culture?” Most often, I am met with blank stares.

    And, the truth can never make you feel insignificant – it might hurt at first, but then it empowers. There is a wonderful little book called The Book of Qualities by J. Ruth Gendler. I got it years ago and treasure it. Here’s something she’s written about Courage (all qualities are personified and she has line drawings of what she thinks they look like):

    Courage has roots. She sleeps on a futon on the floor and lives close to the ground. Courage looks you straight in the ey. She is now impressed with powertrippers and she knows first aid. Courage is not afraid to week and she is not afraid to pray, even when she is not sure who she is praying to. When Courage walks, it is clear that she has made the journey from lonliness to solitude. The people who told me she was stern were not lying; they just forgot to mention that she was kind.

  7. Delphyne says:

    Sorry – typos! Courage looks you straight in the eye. She is NOT impressed….Not afraid to weep.

    I’m typing fast because there is a terrific thunderstorm headed our way in NJ and I need to get off the computer now.

  8. abycat says:

    Dakinikat – what a wonderful post. I think our history is what has brought out so much passion in all of us around Hillary’s campaign and the push back now is a result of all of us having been on the receiving end of the misogyny, sexism and gender discrimination that was on full display in this election. It is infuriating to see women that enable this to continue to happen. That I will never understand. In some ways, this election has been good in that it has awakened something in all of us that has been below the surface, at least for me, since the 1970’s. We have not come nearly as far as I had thought. Now we are ready to fight for our right to have a woman as the leader of the free world. It is Hillary’s and our time.

    adamonis, I can so relate to what you said. My story is your story. Even today. I wish I had been stronger and fought back harder against it all. I am not proud of taking it and going along, being a good little girl, for so long. Always settling for less, working hard to make men look good. It has not served me well. I am in my mid-50’s now and I realize how much different my life might have been if I had been more like Hillary and not been so convinced that I was not good enough for so much of what I really wanted. Maybe that is why this election has been so heartbreaking for me. Hillary Clinton is the one person that I thought was strong enough to fight back and get to the place that she so richly deserves, that we all deserve. But things will be different now. There is really no going back to that place anymore for me. I have had enough of people telling me to shut up and get over it. I take solace knowing that I am not alone and that collectively we have real power to finally affect real change.

    Really great post. Thanks.

  9. JSF says:

    I can see the Jefferson Memorial from my job. Over 25 years ago, the progressive men trashed us women over underneath that memorial during a week of anti-war protests. Women got it together during a precious few days on Saturday and Sunday and fought back. Unfortunately, the soldiers threw us out of the park and we scattered across DC. We protested the war, we were changed by so many amazing events, and then we went home feminists.

    Remember Beijing? It’s a much bigger speaking stage than some small Chicago locale. I lived oversees at the time and HRC’s speech was incredibly important to women all over the world! It really meant a lot to them.

    Now the boyz claim his speech was more important than hers. They could do that because their concerns are always more important than ours. Or rather, we are always asked to think that ANY concern is our problem. But our concerns are never theirs. And we let them.

    The current refrain, “They will come home; where they gonna go anyway?” is just more of the same.

    Now I read blogs about how as a white woman I never supported AA women, how it is blacks’ time, that Stanton knifed Douglass in the back. Nothing was worse than their struggle, so take a seat in the back, b*tch.

    I am working on not letting any of this effect my personal relationships. But after what they did to Hillary – which they did to all of us really – I’ve made my personal pledge…

    Not one more male gets my vote until a woman is POTUS. And those male-identified butt-hole woe-men like Brazille and Peloser are honorary males for the duration.

  10. Ms. Marple says:

    Thanks for a wonderful post. This is the kind of conversation I’ve tried to have with my family for years. Now that my “girls” are in their 30’s, more and more of what I’ve preached is becoming apparent to them. My grandchildren are certainly getting an earful. One of the girls, aged 8, stayed with me for a month and just went back home today. She likes her web page with dress-up activities on it. She also liked drinking a toast with me as we raised glasses of iced tea and quoted Susan B. Anthony, to “the true Republic – men, their rights and nothing more; women, their rights, and nothing less.” And she had some idea of what we were talking about. There isn’t a good reason for us to make our history lopsided or uninteresting. It’s really gossip at a distance, and we always like to talk about what other people are doing. I just try, while my kids and now grands are young enough to want to listen to me, to make these important women from our past seem as real to them as they were to me. They are going to need all the strong role models they can get.

  11. HT says:

    lurker here delurking to type “wonderful, thoughtful, enlightening” post. I’m glad to see that this is finally being discussed. I can relate to all the commenters as well.
    There are a multitude of stories that could be told, of brilliant women who have been beaten down by the misogny that is prevalent in society. Unfortunately, until women themselves realise the power they could control, until they stop being enablers and start being proactive doers, it will not change. Throughout my career in a multinational company, women who had transcended the glass ceiling were the ones most vehemently keeping other women from following, rather than blazing a path for others to follow. Strange, that. Could never understand it. That is not to excuse the male suppression of females, taking their ideas and making them their own etc etc, but I expected more from successful women.
    On a personal level, I divorced at 33 after 14 years of marriage. I was making more money, yet my role was supposed to be one of submission. Screw that. During that 14 years, I had some health problems related to a pregnancy, where I had specialists (all men) tut-tutting my concerns. They didn’t listen, paid no attention to my input, patted me on the head and told me to be a good girl and listen to the experts. I haven’t had a male doctor since that time. I also have a female lawyer, as my experience during the divorce was excrutiating. On a good note, I decided to have children outside marriage, raised them on my own without support and am not the proud mama of two young adults in college and university.
    Women can do anything. If only they would collectively wake up and realize that, we might have a different world.

  12. Shtuey says:

    Thank you for helping get the conversation going! Outstanding!

  13. epicurious says:

    hey dakinikat – wonderful post! by the way, it’s the 160th anniversary of the women’s convention.

    See you at Seneca Falls I hope.

  14. dakinikat says:

    oops, thx, epicurious

  15. anonymous says:

    dakinikat, thank you for your post. we women are always being asked to wait, to let others go first. we are always promised that our concerns will be addressed some other day. it’s tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow and then we’re dead. it’s so hard to watch our daughters believe the same lies that betrayed us. i read young Obama supporters saying “i can understand why older women support Clinton. if had to put up with all the misogyny that i’ve seen during this election for 20 more years, i’d support Clinton too.” or “if i’d been told to wait that long, i’d want a women president now too.” i want to shake them and make them realize that unless they do something NOW, they will have to put up with the misogyny for the next 20 years (and longer).

    abycat, i wanted to say that i was tortured and abused when i was a child, mostly because i was a girl. one thing that i learned that applies to all women: if you are silent, you will be told that you are complicit in your exploitation. you will be blamed for it and you will learn to blame yourself. you will be even more quiet about your mistreatment. if you speak up, you will be punished – beaten down – and blamed for your abuse. you will learn to blame yourself. you will be afraid to speak up about your mistreatment.

    i saw this at work and in other situations. if i spoke up, i was seen as not being a team player. i was punished. i kicked myself for not playing the game. if i said nothing, i was seen as a doormat. i felt guilty for silently allowing unfair treatment that hurt other women as well as me.

    the dynamic was different only in that the punishment in the workplace and society was not a literal beating or other tangible abuse. but the mechanism was the same. i think most oppressors work that way: they not only oppress you, they teach you that you deserve to be oppressed and sometimes they teach you to oppress others.

    the system is designed so that you will not win no matter what you do. i think seeing that happen to Hillary was a painful reminder of that reality to millions of women. it was a very public confirmation that sexism is invidious, pervasive, and acceptable in the USA. it was like watching all the things that have privately happened to each of us but that, until now, we had suffered in isolation. things that, until now, we had blamed ourselves for. but now we see that we are not alone. and that when we are together and determined, we are powerful. that’s why i’m thankful for blogs like this one.

  16. As a gay male, I cannot presume to understand the depths to which this primary has wounded the souls of women. I can only state the depths to which my soul was wounded.

    If I were a great scribe I might be able to express my feelings of support for the noble women of this blog. But, I am not anywhere near the league of those who post here.

    I am however, extremely distressed by the outright hostility toward women during this primary and continues today, that goes way beyond any label that one could place on it.

    I was repeatedly abused as a child. This election brings up emotions that feel a lot like that. However, I am no longer a victim, I choose to speak up. I have a voice. I choose to run, and not just walk away.

    I am standing with you, shoulder to shoulder, to say that it is not acceptable to subjegate women for the greater good. It is not acceptable that HRC should be forced, as women always have been, to stand behind yet another inadequated male, in order to “preserve” her legacy in the party, and to retire her debt.

    Why does it always come down to economics? Is it not enough that she campaigned her heart out for herself and every person in the USA regardless of gender. Why does she now have to do anything for BHO?

    I may not articulate my position as well as others. But, I am in full support of you and your efforts and I hope you accept me and any support that I can give.

  17. Lynne from Fl says:

    I will point out an interesting phenomenon. I like reality tv and have always watched Survivor. Mostly, I watch to see how the women will do and how they will deal with the concept of the game. In several seasons the women remaining toward the end, had a numerical advantage and could easily have assured that a woman would win. In each case, at some point, one or more women would dump the other women and, in the end, insure a male victory. I would shake my head and wonder what was wrong with them. That is, until this last season, when a very feisty young woman from Alpharetta, GA, pulled off an amazing upset. She had help from other women, and, for once they did the simplest of things…they stayed true to each other. What I am saying is that maybe it is time, maybe women are, finalyy, coming to see that together we can, actually, change things for the better.

    I was heavily involved in politics earlier in life, and in political action and I remember very clearly one of the basic precepts that activists all acknowledged. That was that you could never count on black people to not cross your picket line. Very often they would go out of their way to cross, just to not be part of whatever minority you were representing. When the tables were turned, we didn’t eat at Sambo’s and we took all the other steps we could to help change the world for the down-trodden. Yes, it is about time that women stood up for themselves, and we may get help here, but in the end, we have to be willing to do this for ourselves, and to beleive that we are worthy of just taking our own stand. Not for somebody else, just for us.

  18. anonymous says:


    first, your voice is as important as anyone else’s. that’s what i thought the Democratic Party stood for and why i’m so appalled at how so many of us (women, the LGBT community, hispanics, asians, the elderly, those with less money or education, the disabled, etc.) have been not only ignored but belittled and vilified during this election cycle. we should all stand together for human rights.

    when i say that women need to make sure that their rights are not ignored, i don’t mean that we can’t put other ppls’ rights on par with our own, especially when those other ppl are standing with me and demanding equal rights for all of us. i mean that i will make sure that i do not put some other group or other agenda ahead of myself or my own rights or agenda. (obviously, other people may mean something different.)

    I was repeatedly abused as a child. This election brings up emotions that feel a lot like that.

    i’ve read so many women say that Obama reminds them of their abusive husband. i think Obama (as well as some of his campaign staff, many of his supporters, and the media) reminds many ppl of someone who has bullied or abused them. that seems very unusual to me. why does Obama remind so many people of their abuser? this is a very troubling aspect of Obama’s candidacy that i haven’t seen discussed in any serious way.

  19. KendallJ says:

    WOW!!! This was an amazingly well thought out post. Thank you for being so prevoking. It was our turn and Hillary’s turn, and once again we were thrown under the bus. I’m very proud of Hillary because she stood up for herself and for all of us. She was so strong under such incredible pressure, abuse and so enemies came at her from all directions. I can’t think of a single man who could have been stronger!!!!

    We women have to stand up for ourselves, our sisters, our mothers and our daughters. We can’t let men or sexulality or male approval or fear or anything else keep us from advancing our gender.

    One of the biggest problems we have is that our history is bured, denied and erased. I’ve noticed that younger women are less informed about our history than I was in say my early thirtes. I manage attorneys for a legal service program, and it reacently surprised to learn how little legal or historical context the younger women lawyers in my office with regard to women and our struggles. I took women’s studies in collage and I studied and learned more on my own. But what shocked me is how little women’s history and issues are tought in our schools. I think women’s studies, programs are declining and our girls have no historical or social context from which to draw any perspective.

    Most of them in my office had never heard of Elizabeth Catty Stanton or Alice Paul. They didn’t know that it was not until 1966 that women were allowed to obtain birth control.

    We are failing in educating our children about women and our civil rights. We need to push for history lessons to include women in public schools. They teach about Martin Luther King Jr. and the civil rights movement, but say nothing about women’s rights and struggles.


  20. LAMusing says:

    wonderful, wonderful post! THANK YOU!

    I’m printing it out to give to a few friends that don’t do the email thing. I hope you post this at Bitterpoliticz, too.

  21. wodiej says:

    Wow-This is an excellent post. Great way to start my Monday morning!

    Bluedawg, your support is very much appreciated. It is so nice to hear words such as yours from a guy. I know there are others like you -I just don’t happen to know any.

    My thoughts are with everyone who has been abused whether it was verbally, emotionally and/or physically. I suffered verbal and emotional abuse from my mother for 45 years who I severed my relationship with a year ago so I can lead a peace filled and happy life. It is unfortunate in some respects but it is one of the very best things I could have done for myself.

    That being said, I answer to NO ONE. I am a gay woman and maybe that makes it easier to have that attitude. Many words in this post rung a bell for me such as keeping our mouths shut in the workplace etc. Where I work all the managers are men and the women work for them. When I bring a concern to their attention they either ignore me or come unglued. My boss who happens to be a nice guy but doesn’t have a spine, actually called me into his office because he said my concerns were negative and asked if I liked working there! That sounded like and I basically asked, if that was a threat of being shown to the door. A man gets away with all kinds of horseshit while women have to toe the line. I give men NO SLACK, no going to the head of the line, no special treatment. I am aghast in this day and age of the arrogance from modern day men who still treat women like they are 2nd class.

    I too am disgusted by women who do have some power that have fallen in line with the good ole’ boys club. Shame on them. Until women work together as a group, stick together and say “no more”, society and men will continue to get away with treating us like crap.

    I have always been very feisty and sassy and I just refuse to be anything less than what I am. Believe in yourselves and your worth.

  22. Sima says:

    Wow, What a great post! It’s really got me thinking, and examining my behavior to see if there’s any way I can stand up more for women. I’ve been counseled all my life to ‘go along to get along’. but that’s not working anymore.

    And yes, this primary season has seemed like abuse to me. Abused as a child, I can’t stand to see Obama’s face. I’m projecting probably, but his smug use of misogyny makes me want to throw up.

    Remember the video geeklove made ‘Im not gonna take it anymore/Bitch’? Well, my husband and I watched that. Mind you, we don’t have a TV so we never see these news people, these pundits. I was sobbing after the first few minutes, and my husband was shaking in rage. How DARE they say such things about a woman, how DARE they? He’s nearly come to blows with friends since then, who make ‘jokes’ about his Hillary t shirt (which he still wears proudly). And me, I try and give ’em hell verbally. I’m so sick of this shit.

  23. kenoshaMarge says:

    From the response here and elsewhere it may be that one good thing will come out of this corrupt Democratic Primary.

    That one thing being a reigniting, a reuniting of women who have had this crap up to here…

    The misogynist media, and both misogynist political parties as well as the turncoat women may well find they have awoken a sleeping dragon. A big, self-aware, angry female dragon. As well as millions of PUMAs.

  24. Lynne from Fl says:

    I have been checking in on-line to several other sites, and found that when I posteda suggestion that we pick one day to all make a $20.00 donation to retire Hillary’s debt, my comments weren’t posted. When I forcefully asked why, they told me that this is a war, and we will need all of ourresources to insure that Obama doesn’t get in.

    Here’s the problem…once agian, some other agenda is being proferred. We are mostly pissed off at the way Hillary and her supporters were treated. Yes, there is also the fact the Pres. Obama is a scary prospect. But…back to the campaign. We had an intelligent, articulate, giving, experieinced candidate, and she and her supporters were thrown under the bus. I can’t help but beleive that along with all the other things we need to do now, is to finish her candidacy by paying off her debt, and not hanging her out there in the Obama breeze. Why can’t we do this?

  25. Ms. Marple says:

    Well, a hot and sweaty good morning from one sister who is doing it for herself. Why do I always have to move house on the hottest day of the year?? One defective golf cart down and many trips to make before the days’ end. On this little island, most people drive carts…I usually go by shank’s mare, Bahamian for on foot. The one teeny tiny problem with being independent sometimes is that you have to do things for yourself when you would rather not! I am off to seek some manpower and a bigger vehicle. But I can’t resist reading during pit stops. My body may poop out but I can still replenish my mind here. Thanks for the brain food, I need all I can get lately.

  26. Spiritof76 says:

    Thank you all. This is powerful, both the original post and the responses. I skimmed it last night and got up early so I could read it in full. There is pain here and evidence of the the great strength that arises from facing the pain. Can’t write any more–I have to absorb all this and think.

    woodiej–as one who is old enough (by far) to be your parent, I affirm that you did the right thing, painful as it must be.

  27. dakinikat says:

    Lynne, there are many of us trying to do the same thing. There is a ‘movement’ afoot to get as many folks as possible to donate $20.08 to retire HIllary’s debt for Independence day. There is a thread on this a few posts down from this one. You can always click the pretty Hillary poster on the left side-bar here to get to Heidi Li’s site. She has been a tireless fundraiser for Hillary. She is working hard right now to help her pay off the debt and ensure that she gets a ballot call in Denver. Would suggest you go to her site and read about that effort. We want to deliver her to the convention in a position to fight for whatever she can.

  28. Maybe I identify with women because of the 12 years of sexual/physical/mental and emotional abuse I edured at the hands of my abuser.

    Maybe it is because of the social abuse I endured because I wasn’t a “normal” little boy, I was branded a sissy very early, which eventually lead to the labels of faggot and cocksucker.

    I was beaten up repeatedly, teased and tortured, and that was in school. I am 40 y/o and still deal with rude comments about my sexuality. I am not a flamer, I do not shove it in peoples faces but, I make no apologies for the person I am.

    Maybe I identify with women because my mother spent her life caring for 5 children, her elderly parents, a sisters who had suffered a nervous breakdown, as well as anyome else who called her with a need.

    Maybe I identify with women because I know that my mother was the glue that held our family together and it was her financial genious that saved our home and kept our family afloat during difficult economic times.

    As a man, if I can ever become half the person that my mother is as a women. I will be a sucess.

    My father recently told me I should stay with my partner, instead of going to Iowa to help with the flood recovery. He intimated that my partner might decide he can do without me and I would lose the security I have with him, given my, PTSD and depression, I need him to take care of me.

    Are there women out there who have endured anything of which I posted? Have any of you been told not to become too independent by a parent or friend because you might lose a relationship?

  29. Mary Beth says:

    Lynne from Fl. ..I agree, I think we should have one day push to get as many people to give 20.00 to retire her debt. It wouuld send a message, to the Dems and BO supporters, that WE will do the right thing and support Hill, not support the SELECTED nominee, by raising money for him.!
    I love this post, and I too learned from it. Maybe next year it will be us ,the PUMAS, meeting in Senaca Falls on the 161st Anniversary!!

  30. Sima says:

    I haven’t been told that by my parents (I’m lucky, they are/were wonderful). But I have been told that by most of my other relatives. Or this one, ‘Don’t get too smart, no man’ll want you’. Or this one, ‘Men like pretty women, not smart women’. Or this one, ‘Find a man and grab him, opportunities like that won’t come along often for a girl like you’. (Meaning someone who liked books more than boys). Or this one, ‘Why are you parents sending you to college, you are just going to get married?’ Or at the age of 20 ‘Why aren’t you married yet, couldn’t capture a man?’ Ohh, if they only knew.

    So yes, I’ve been told that, I think a lot of women have. It’s interesting and important to get your perspective, I am saddened to think friends and relatives use the same lines on men and boys too. I wish I’d known you in school, I’d have beat up your tormentors!

  31. freewheeling says:

    Have any of you been told not to become too independent by a parent or friend because you might lose a relationship?

    Of course we have. We’re told that all the time. Isn’t that obvious? Isn’t that kind of what happened to Hillary–the mentality that you can only go so far and achieve so much, and if you exceed the patriarchy’s comfort level, then you will be punished? Be abandoned? Be told you’re unlovable? Be told you’re a horrible bitch who must be brought down? Psssst….that’s how they try to control us.

    I’m thankful every day that I’m a lesbian because I had to grow up without societal approval. I don’t expect it. I know it’s not coming, and I’ve learned how to function without it. This experience has helped me learn how to spot bullshit a mile away. It’s also hard. The tormentors take their toll, of course. But life is tough sometimes. I wonder why we expect life not to be tough. Living in truth is worth it. One reason I love Hillary so much is because she’s like an honorary lesbian to me. She moves forward despite all of the psyching-out they try to pull on her. She’s impervious. It really is a beautiful thing. She’s a heterosexual lesbian to me.

    Hell, Blue Dawg read some first wave feminist books. You might identify with a great deal of what they discuss. I’m serious.

    Best of luck, and thanks for a great post.

  32. Palmer says:

    “Whenever women make progress, men step in with some other distraction and create disunity. ”

    So true. Thank you so much for this blog. You have articulated so well what I have noticed just even in the past few years.

  33. Sima,

    I wish I had known you in high school too. My best friend was a beautiful girl who was shunned because she had cystic acne. She was called pizza face.

    My other friend was a girl that had a “reputation” because someone said she slept around. She was a virgin.

    I think a lot of my tormentors deserved a beat down, although I abhor violence but, I believe others were just jealous. I had George Michael’s hairstyle and wore cool clothes – a mixture of my own designs, trendy 80’s, and vintage. I was my own person and not a cookie cutter of everyone else! At least that what I tell myself.


    Can you give me some titles? I am an advocate of bettering onself through education. As you said…” life is tough” but, “Living in truth is worth it.” I could not agree more.

    Thanks to you both, and to everyone else who has offered their heartfelt warmth and welcomes, I thank you for the honor of your company.

    You may have read this elsewhere as I gave Murphy @ Puma and NQ and several other blogs permission to publish this as they wanted, with or without credit to me as the author. It is also on my blog.

    The following is my personal tribute to you, Hillary Rodham Clinton. I am no Mya Angelou but, I hope you enjoy it nonetheless.

    I AM ONE…

    I am one,

    I am one of 18 million,

    I am one with them in history,

    I am one with them in her story,

    I am one with them in our story…

    I am no longer invisible,

    I am respected,

    I am vocal,

    I am one…

    Blessings on your day,

  34. Lynne from Fl says:

    I will pass on another item that I learned back in the seventies and eighties in political action, that whenever women’s issues come to the forefront, men in power pull on the pursestrings. Nothing derails the concerns of women and children as fast as trying to figure out how to feed your family, and pay the rent or mortgage. At one point I went back through the previous forty years or so ( that was what was readily availble for research then), and it looked awfully suspicious that the people in power had used tightening money supplies over and over whenever it seemed that social issues were getting out of control.

    Curiously, that is what the Dems have done this time, the problem is that not only did they run over a whole lot of us, and sacrifice what we had tradintionally thought to be party ideals, but they have substituted a power base with motives that we have no real means ot decyphering. It may be just a good old Chicago power grab, mixed with misogyny, or the real deep racial hatred we glimpsed may point all this in another direction. I know it has had terrible consequences in my racial relations, and in those of most of my friends, a horrible side-effect of all this. All together, what the power elite have done is virtually unforgivable.

    Last word, I mentioned trying to retire Hillary’s debt in a set time frame so they know it is from us. I got an e-mail from Professional for Hillary, to try to make the donations between now and Wednesday.So, I urge anyone who can spare $10 ro $20 to do so now, and take care of what the men don’t seem to want to do. Don’t get me wrong, every bit of help from men is welcome, but if they choose to not do this, then I think it is up to the women who understand what being left holding the bag is all about. By the way, I ran for N.Y. Assembly many years ago, and remember very well what it meant to have that visible support.

  35. Sharon says:

    I lived in upstate NY close to the Senaca Falls Women’s Museum where the history of that convention and the movement involved in it are being kept for posterity. And, I am a direct descendent of John Adams. So I must have gotten a ‘double whammy’.

    I personally see this election year as taking women in a backward momentum through the last 4 decades of progress. It has been extremely sad for me to watch the younger generations’ , almost non-existent, reactions to this. They cannot possibly know what we endured to get as far as we did because they didn’t have to fight those individualized battles. It is sad, because they may have to fight them AGAIN in the future!

    Take Care, Sharon

  36. baby says:

    Nice website!!

  37. Right to Vote says:

    When a man and a woman are trying to make a point during a discussion, argument….
    People will call woman a BICH……
    People will call man a GENIOUS……
    Sound familiar?????
    I always laugh at theat.

  38. Right to Vote says:

    I always laugh at that.