Expert Tells Guardian UK: “Japan may have lost race to save nuclear reactor”
Posted: March 29, 2011 Filed under: A My Pet Goat Moment, Foreign Affairs, Japan, toxic waste, We are so F'd | Tags: Cancer, corporate malfeasance, Fukushima nuclear plant, Japan, nuclear meltdown, plutonium 40 Comments
Google photo of Fukushima Nuclear Plant
Ian Sample, science correspondent for the Guardian, writes:
Richard Lahey, who was head of safety research for boiling-water reactors at General Electric when the company installed the units at Fukushima, told the Guardian workers at the site appeared to have “lost the race” to save the reactor, but said there was no danger of a Chernobyl-style catastrophe….
“The indications we have, from the reactor to radiation readings and the materials they are seeing, suggest that the core has melted through the bottom of the pressure vessel in unit two, and at least some of it is down on the floor of the drywell,” Lahey said. “I hope I am wrong, but that is certainly what the evidence is pointing towards.”
The major concern when molten fuel breaches a containment vessel is that it reacts with the concrete floor of the drywell underneath, releasing radioactive gases into the surrounding area. At Fukushima, the drywell has been flooded with seawater, which will cool any molten fuel that escapes from the reactor and reduce the amount of radioactive gas released.
Lahey said: “It won’t come out as one big glob; it’ll come out like lava, and that is good because it’s easier to cool.”….
“The reason we are concerned is that they are detecting water outside the containment area that is highly radioactive and it can only have come from the reactor core,” Lahey added. “It’s not going to be anything like Chernobyl, where it went up with a big fire and steam explosion, but it’s not going to be good news for the environment.”
Last night, ABC News talked to physicist Michio Kaku.
“Apparently, there is a crack, a crack in the vessel by which radiation is escaping,” U.S. physicist Michio Kaku said. “This could mean that if the core begins to melt, we could have a steam explosion, a hydrogen gas explosion like Chernobyl.”
So the nuke guy says it won’t be like Chernobyl, Kaku says it will. I guess we have no choice except to just wait and see.
FYI, here is an earlier interview with Kaku at KATU, Portland, Oregon.
Michio Kaku’s comments came after news that Japanese nuclear experts said they suspect there has been a possible breach at the Fukushima Dai-ichi nuclear complex.
“This is huge. For the first time, they’re using that dreaded word, ‘breach,’ Kaku said during an interview at KATU’s studios. “Plutonium is the most toxic chemical known to science. A speck of plutonium, a millionth of a gram, could cause cancer.”
No matter how much Tepco and pro-nuke “experts” insist there is no danger to humans from the material that has escaped the plant, there simply is no safe level of plutonium.
The Tokyo Electric Company confirmed that AREVA-manufactured fuel assemblies containing plutonium have at least partially melted down when they said that plutonium was found on five separate sites on the reactor grounds, and they had matched the plutonium signature of fuel produced at AREVA’s La Hague facility. The fuel assemblies were first loaded in the reactor at Fukushima last September and were in Reactor 3 when the 14 meter tsunami overwhelmed the nuclear plant.
Despite the fact that plutonium is one of the most deadly substances in existence, TEPCO has insisted there is no health danger from the plutonium found on site. According to health experts, plutonium particles absorbed in the human body vastly increases the chance of dying from a fatal form of cancer.
The former DOE official said, “NNSA was warned this kind of event could happen and they chose to build the MOX plant anyway. Maybe what Japan is going through will wake up people who can call a halt to this.”
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Anyone with half a brain can figure out that if there is plutonium in the ground around the plant (and we have know that for a couple of days), then the core of at least one of the reactors has been breached.
Tepco should not be in control of what is happening right now. There is too much on the line to let a corporation investigate its own failures.
Yes, this not only effects Japan’s immediate area around the plant, this is a global issue. What Kaku says makes sense to me. Scary stuff…
We won’t be affected by the plutonium, and the radioactive fallout won’t be too bad unless there is an explosion like at Chernobyl. After Chernobyl, milk in NYC was contaminated. We all got a dose.
Guest Post: Government Responds to Nuclear Accident by Trying to Raise Acceptable Radiation Levels and Pretending that Radiation is Good For Us « naked capitalism
The spin is starting to get even more ridiculous. Plutonium detected near nuke plant ‘not significant’: U.S. official | Kyodo News
What is wrong with these people?
As I posted earlier,
Poison particles from nuke plant found in AT LEAST 12 U.S. states as Japan is put on ‘maximum’ radiation alert
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1371236/Japan-maximum-radiation-alert-Poison-particles-12-US-states.html#ixzz1I1DLkKc4
One of the reasons you just can’t trust the news media or any government on this planet. Didn’t they say over and over and over that no radioactive material could possibly get to the U.S. and even if it did it would present no danger? I am completely skeptical.
So far this is just small amounts of radioactive iodine and it hasn’t been found in drinking water or food yet. We probably don’t have too much to worry about.
But as I posted yesterday, it has been found in rainwater in Boston, and officials are testing all the reservoirs, so there must be some need for concern.
The water I drink and the food I eat are both affected by rainwater. This thing isn’t contained yet. I agree that there is reason for concern.
I found this on google–don’t know how accurate it is, but it sounds somewhat credible.
Wow…I tell you the panic that will ensue if all this comes out a truth will be massive. There are such high populations around the plant, Tokyo is only 150 miles away right?
People in Tokyo have already been exposed and they know it. Pregnant women are fleeing the area for fear of what will happen to their babies.
So, one of our bunker busting nuclear devices?
Not sure that would be a good idea at all because I doubt that the Uranium and Plutonium would be vaporized in such an explosion. Probably would just spread it everywhere and probably make 1/2 of Japan or more completely uninhabitable.
As it is, I wonder how/if and where we can evacuate the population of Japan to if the situation becomes to extreme.
That’s a scary thought. What happens if that water gets into the sea or a river that goes all over? They could have all kinds of spoiled ecosystems.
Hmmm…maybe I was wrong about the plutonium. Check this out from Washington’s blog:
And this:
Plutonium is basically man made by adding neutrons to uranium 238 which is not fissionable. The uranium 238 then decays into neptunium which has a 1/2 life of 2 days and that further decays into plutonium. Plutonium is useful because while it has a tremendously long 1/2 life it is fissionable which is where cesium and radioactive iodide and other compounds come from.
The problem here is that we have an uncontrolled reaction where the plutonium is releasing neutrons and basically bombarding the uranium which is resulting in more and more plutonium being created. There is just no telling how long these reactions are going to be sustained and continue to leak radiation. I guess if we had the pertinent data available we could calculate these things.
From my limited understanding of nuclear physics reactor #3 sounded suspiciously like what one of my old texts called a breeder reactor which was supposed to double its energy output in 5 to 7 years. That would be in a controlled setting without moderators. I don’t think the situation that we have now has any precedence at all and everything is really up in the air.
What I find most disconcerting is the proximity to the other plants and reactors. If they can’t get this under control and it undergoes a complete meltdown what happens to the other facilities?
gregoryp,
From what I have read, the experts fear a multiple meltdown. Four reactors are thought to be compromised.
I do think that the experts have been divided on just what is going to happen here. Nuclear explosion or a sustained meltdown? Seems we are getting the latter. Also, not sure the meltdown caused the cracks. Could be that the reason there was no water in the reactors was that they sustained heavy damage during the earthquake and tsunami. The crack could have taken place at any time.
What is clear to me though is that situation needs to be contained sooner rather than later. I thought we had remote controlled robots that could traverse these kinds of environments and videotape the damage. Seems they should know more than they actually do.
They still haven’t decided if just one has the melt down or more either. And, now they have all this contaminated water to do something with. This response just doesn’t seem very well planned or implemented. I think Japan should be putting together an international team of experts to replace the TEPCO show.
The Japanese government has to decide, and quick, who will it serve? The people of Japan or The Tokyo Electric Company. They can’t serve both and so far it’s been the company
Japan just got hit with a 6.3 quake of the main isle.
Another one? Unbelieveable.
That fault appears very active right now. I heard some geologist say it would be for some time that it wasn’t finished doing something that it was undergoing but the terms were so technical I didn’t really catch the name for it. Something about one plate folding under another and reaching some kind of place where it would slow down.
Something about one plate folding under another
sounds like its making a new mountain range !
I should’ve paid more attention to my geology professor back in the day.
Thank you for your information!! Please visit us again!!!
Dear lady,
I come back. Was it a joke to come back? I am new into the process. But, if necessary, I will come with genuine brand new ideas related to how can be mitigated such unfortunate global effect.
With deep respect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU
No joke. Sincere Welcome!!
Dear Lady dakinicat,
Here into the above request, I mean Letter to the European Commission, is the unfortunately for Japan, new, in fact old from 1993, my idea on how to protect Nuclear Power Plants, against Earthquakes with magnitude over Design Value. Unfortunatelly I can not add to the comment column, my resume, the copy of the patent and of documents by which these guys do not aprove the money for some patent testing and for internationally application.
My English is not too good, but if you can promote to the editor or to the appropiate institutions, please, do it for me, in may name, please.
Many thanks.
With deep respect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU
Well, I’m just an economist but if we’re going to get into producing energy this way at all, it needs to be safe as possible and we appreciate your expertise! Usually if you put things out, eventually some things start coming back!
Dear Lady,dakinikat
Can I have an e-mail adress from Mr. Ian Sample, science correspondent for the Guardian? Because I know to use only e-mail transmission of Resume, pattent copy and so on. Beside of this aspect, except my Resume, the other are in Romnanian, from original documents, and it may be translated via Guardian?. I will explain any other aspects, if required.
With deep respect and consideration dor any help to imprive a little bit this world,
Constantin ROBITU
The Guardian doesn’t seem to list e-mails for its writers. They do list these contact addresses:
Report errors or inaccuracies: reader@guardian.co.uk
Letters for publication should be sent to: letters@guardian.co.uk
Does that help?
BB
Many thanks BB, I will try and I will appreciate very much if we will do something good for humanity.
I may put you these doccuments on your e-mail adress too?
With deep reapect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU
COMMENTS AND ASSUMPTIONS ON THE ARTICLE AND SUBJECT:
1. The assumption may be more than correct because the fact that the Earthquake was greater than Design Earthquake Value of Shut Down System#1 solid Cadmium bars, thus, these solid Cadmium bars did not went, or partially did not went into reactor core, in order to Shut Down Nuclear Reaction in 0,2 seconds time. result, partial meltdown and then going down through the Cadmium bars access holes into reactor vessel, to concrete, well known that it dehydrate at more than 95 Celsius degrees, thus, going to, or through, concrete sub base of the building to soil water which goes to the ocean, thus explaining the recorded value of 4000 times greater ocean radiation.
2. Given I131 existence into ocean water, it may be assumed that the molten fuel does still exist and also the nuclear reaction critical mass, on the other words, not controlled nuclear reaction still exists, similar to Chernobyl accident.
Cause? Non controlled Power Excursion or not controlled reactivity excursion, meaning uncontrolled nuclear reaction increase, due to Earthquake level 9 Richter scale, which blocked or at least delayed the SDS#1 solid Cadmium bars normal intervention.
Other way, if the nuclear reaction is stopped properly, in time, there is no reactivity excursion, meaning no uncontrolled nuclear reaction increase, then fuel temperature is reduced by cooling to a rate of max. let’s say 2.9 Celsius degrees/minute and if you do not cool at all the fuel it will occur cracks on the fuel bars zirconium tubes and fuel will be spreading and finally heated due to decay heat produced by unstable isotopes, not by uncontrolled nuclear reaction continuation, meaning excursion.
3. I come back with an easier explanation: In nuclear fuel does produces 2 types of heat: 1. nuclear heat due to nuclear fission reaction (200MeV/fission) and 2. decay heat due to unstable resulted isotopes.
Obviously, the most important and powerful heat is the heat produced due to nuclear reaction fission.
How can be verified the molten fuel critical mass existence?
By measuring existing neutron flux in Fukushima each reactor, by neutron flux monitoring device and process, not only by I131 existence into water ocean.
4. Positive assumption may be:
If the I131 ocean water doze do not increase, over 4000times as is, and is not measured any neutron flux, then,
The nuclear reaction fission may be finished and so called over poisoning process is occurring.
What is over poisoning process?
When nuclear reaction fission os stopped, it occurs an increase of highly neutron absorbent I131, which stop any attempt to start up nuclear reaction fission for 48 hours.
5. There is a Probabilistic Risk Assessment study for every nuclear power plant type in which the Earthquake is one of so called “Common cause” analysis, and none of the analyses did assumed to surpass the Earthquake design value of 8 on Richter scale. As a parenthesis, please have into consideration “how many times” is exceeded the displacement value of Earthquake value of 8 on Richter scale, compared to 9 on Richter scale, given the fact that Richter scale is an exponential scale.
6. Is useless to put garbage under carpet, trying to cover some aspects, because this demonstrate the missing Nuclear Safety Culture of the person, because the first principle of the Nuclear safety Culture is: First is Nuclear Safety, not other “economical” considerations.
7. Is better to have a wise analysis, no matter how much costs, than, false one, due to wrong actions, time lost, bad consequences, so on.
8. Is far well known that nuclear energy is worth full for humanity and may be improved by science basically in two main wais:
1. combined nuclear fuel and cycles (FBR and PWR as example) for reducing the nuclear fuel quantity, thus nuclear risk;
2. reducing nuclear risk to conventional local risks associated to conventional power plants values.
With deep respect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU
Thank you very much for this information.
You are wellcome.
Dear Lady,
May I have the same request as I already asked to dakinikat?
Can I have an e-mail adress from Mr. Ian Sample, science correspondent for the Guardian? Because I know to use only e-mail transmission of Resume, pattent copy and so on. Beside of this aspect, except my Resume, the other are in Romnanian, from original documents, and it may be translated via Guardian?. I will explain any other aspects, if required.
With deep respect and consideration dor any help to imprive a little bit this world,
Constantin ROBITU
TO GUARDIAN U.K. EDITOR:
DOWNHERE IS MY E-MAIL LETTER TO EUROPEAN COMMISSION, WITH NOT ANSWER YET.
CAN YOU GET BETTER PRESENTATION TO THE APPROPIATE INSTITUTIONS IN ORDER TO PROMOTE THE FOLLOWING MENTIONED PATTENT WHICH I HAVE?
LETTER:
Dear Sirs,
I would like to express some opinions on the subject, “European Commission stated that nuclear plants undergo stress tests into 27 EU countries”, article:
“Wim De Clercq
Wim De Clercq, general director of the Belgian nuclear power station in Tihange, explains how a nuclear power station works during a news conference in Tihange March 16, 2011. The European Commission said on Tuesday it wanted nuclear plants to undergo stress tests to prove their safety, not only in the 27 EU countries, but also in neighbouring states.… Read more »
REUTERS/Yves Herman (BELGIUMDISASTER – Tags: ENERGY ENVIRONMENT) “
1. I am an ex-nuclear diplomat nuclear engineer from Romania, I attach my resume for better understanding of the problem.
2. I want to clarify who are the authors of Fukushima nuclear accident.
They are two:
-first is the Japan company, and I will not develop the subject, being in analysis;
-second, moral authors, by delaying the attached patent, done in 1993 and patented in 1996, applying and further use for other purposes in order to get some supplementary money.
I will speak on the second subject.
Shortly, by my patent I intended to extend nuclear power plant protection against Earthquakes greater than usual Design Base Earthquake or Site Design Earthquake which is in general of 8 Richter scale by following measures:
1. to install at approximately 20-30km from nuclear power plant site, on 3 directions, each at 60 º from other, of 3 sets of 2 out of 3 logic measuring Earthquake magnitude devices (one on each direction), in order to give a signal to stop nuclear reaction, by safety systems SDS#1 (28 cadmium bars, operating time 0,2 seconds) and SDS#2 (gadolinium injection, operating time 2 seconds) in approximately 2-4 seconds BEFORE EARTHQUAKE MAXIMUM VALUE OF LET’S SAY 8, 9 RICHTER SCALE (DEPENDING ON THE OWNER WILL), WILL COME OVER SITE.
2. I get the attached patent in 1996, after of 3 years analysis by the Earthquake Institute leaded by Mr. Marmureanu, as general director.
3. I made all the information required in order to apply the new system at Cernavoda Nuclear Power Plant CANDU type and also to make it internationally, but no success because all the time the answer was NO MONEY for such thing.
4. After a while, a company, Zircon, from Romania, developed without patent an cell phone for Earthquake personal alarming;
5. Right now Mr. Marmureanu is developing with The Bucharest Mayor some sort of elevators Earthquake device stopping, and some other usual applications.
Dear Sir,
What I intend to demonstrate are:
1. From 1996 till now, if the patent went to work, may be done some IAEA guides and requirements in order to be provided such devices for nuclear power plants protection, in all the world, thus such accident as FUKUSHIMA could be mitigated properly and smaller consequences also could occur, and now is not late to apply it for the other nuclear power plants, and some military…..applications?.
2.The above mentioned person and structure are the moral authors of the Fukushima accident, by diverting the normal nuclear developing process in order to get some contracts, thus some money.
I and my colleague could not fight with a state corrupted system, combined with some pseudo technical people and secret services also.
Dear Sir,
Why I am writing now to you? Maybe you may get an appropriate way to enforce the patent through European Commission and also to punish at least moral, the above mentioned structure with the lousiest and deep lack of responsibility.
MANY THANKS.
With deep respect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU
Dear Lady/Dear Sir,
Did the crew sample tested to poor Gd (gadolinium) into the fresh salt water injected over top, into reactors, in order to see if is any decrease of radiation dose over reactors? If yes, does the dose decreases? If yes, does the nuclear fission reaction from melted nuclear fuel stopped?
With deep respect and consideration,
Constantin ROBITU